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November 23, 2009


I know it's climate change now since global warming is not working out so well. Just explain for us less intelligent, how did all the ice melt from ice ages and why did we have ice ages, prior to man caused? Could it be the earth goes through cycles?
How's that Hope & Change working out for you? Looks worse on spending,fraud, transparency, but he is spending more on parties and does support the troops less and this is good? Not

Here's a good web site for all you skeptics out there....


Nw, thanks for the excellent link. I hope commenter Mort visits this site. It answers his skeptical question about what caused climate change before humans came along. Short answer:

"Natural climate change in the past proves that climate is sensitive to an energy imbalance. If the planet accumulates heat, global temperatures will go up. Currently, CO2 is imposing an energy imbalance due to the enhanced greenhouse effect. Past climate change actually provides evidence for our climate's sensitivity to CO2."

"Natural climate change in the past proves that climate is sensitive to an energy imbalance. If the planet accumulates heat, global temperatures will go up. Currently, CO2 is imposing an energy imbalance due to the enhanced greenhouse effect. Past climate change actually provides evidence for our climate's sensitivity to CO2."
I know your a rocket scientist, but how did the world solve the problem, it did it without human help, it did not teach cows not to fart, it did not create and electric car as there were none, electric or other wise. The earth has had many more damaging things, that caused much more damage than we can do. Sure the planet is sensitive and climate has changed from volcanos, meteors, all these cooled the earth put C02, ash into the air. What helps plants grow? C02

Mort, do you realize that climate changes have caused mass extinctions on Earth? Our world survives all sorts of changes (obviously), because Earth isn't conscious or alive.

But we humans are affected by climactic changes. The difference between "now" and "then" is that humans are having a large effect on the climate through our use of fossil fuels.

Your argument, which doesn't make sense, is that since nature has screwed up the planet in the past, we humans shouldn't worry about screwing it up even more.

Earth to Mort: our goal should be to have a livable planet. Yes, nature can be cruel. But we humans shouldn't add to the cruelty by our own stupid actions.

The emails are a side show. The program code is where the evidence of fraud will be found. I have programmed computers for sport since the late 70's (I am a physician in my day job). Even I, with a FORTRAN university course 30 years ago can see that the code is designed to give the same answer no matter what the input. So, forget the emails. Show the code to a friend who programs for a living. When he or she quits laughing, you will hear the plain English description of why this isn't even wrong.

I don't have a problem moving away from fossil fuels as better thing are developed. Taxing companies to death and not building nuclear power plants to charge your electric cars will fix what? Put companies out of business, unemployment, raise taxes, this hurts everyone. Don't forget to use more CFL bulbs which will add mecury to the landfills.
We design the best nuclear power plants and sell them to other countries, because the Eco group won't let us build them, or wind, wave power, what clean power is OK?

The global warming crowd are a bunch of pompous a$$es. More and more the true science is showing that their argument is pure hogwash. Ten years from now this will be the joke of the century... oh wait, Al Gore said in 10 years we'd be toast... but wait, that WAS 10 years ago.. hmm... oh well, the Goracle knows best.

"More and more the true science is showing that their argument is pure hogwash"

Show us some links to your "true science", conservativedude.

I went through the suggested link (http://www.skepticalscience.com/argument.php) and when I got to item #31 I am totally confused.

The answer to #1 suggested that solar activities "has little or no long term affect on climate". Yet, for #31 the answer suggests that "early 20th century warming was in large part due to rising solar activity and relatively quiet volcanic activity".

Huh? Don't the two answers contradict each other? Can you really pick and choose when solar activities is significant enough to affect climate and when it does not?

antioch, "early 20th century" isn't the same as "long term," is it? This seems to answer your concern.

Go here http://neithercorp.us/info
click on the media link on the left (big green one) and watch the 75 minute film which features what appear to be heavy duty scientists from such places as MIT and NASA debunking "man made global warming." I haven't paid too much attention to this argument up to now but this film raises the question: have we been punked by Al Gore? He was, after all, the guy who picked Joe Lieberman as his running mate.

I have read some of the leak emails, It is hard to say the scienist in IPCC hid the fact or manipulate the data. we could not say data was manipulated by simply seeing the words " trick ". Iam from Motorola quality department and gad been coping the quality data every day using lot of statistical tool. sometime I play data and have to make some trick to make the chart to be more attactive or more convincible to management. sometimes we have to eliminate or neglect some kinds of data was not because we wanted to change or manipulate, instead we want to emphasis some critical things and did not want the noise( came from wrong measurement system, improper data collection by unskill full persons).

usually the management is very busy to look into the remarks and explanation why the data was not likely matching what we tried to say. for example, we know a process has been improved, but the data might not directly reflect the positive trend only because the data collection is not relative or unintendly distorted by noise or other factors, in that case we have to make correction.

internally, we often use the words "trick" or "tricky" during the data analysis with Six Sigma tools. that only means we found a good way to use the data and not to use some data or noise.

Just by reading one email is not a good way to make conclusion what is the opinion of the speakers. some is just political words or instent thinking.

by Steven chi

I believe you are wrong. Trenberth from the National Center for Atmospheric Research, stated "The fact is that we can’t account for the lack of global warming at the moment and it is a travesty that we can’t".
Science is not decided by popular opinion. In 1400 the PC(politically correct)scientist would have had the earth as the middle of our solar system. Instead of just looking at news reports for the idea global warming, switch it up. See the opposing publics ideas.

Hallie, you're wrong that I'm wrong. Actually, I'm right. Trenberth wasn't referring to an ability to account for long-term global warming, but rather to an inability to account for short-term fluctuations in that indisputable trend. See his paper on the subject:

Here's the abstract of the paper. You really need to do more research before you leave inaccurate comments. Oh, wait -- that's what global warming deniers do: ignore the facts and just say whatever they believe to be true.
"Planned adaptation to climate change requires information about what is happening and why. While a long-term trend is for global warming, short-term periods of cooling can occur and have physical causes associated with natural variability. However, such natural variability means that energy is rearranged or changed within the climate system, and should be traceable. An assessment is given of our ability to track changes in reservoirs and flows of energy within the climate system. Arguments are given that developing the ability to do this is important, as it affects interpretations of global and especially regional climate change, and prospects for the future."

What I get from Trenberths quote cited above is that he really doesn't know what is going on. He is just studying it.

That seems to be the case with warming supporters and detractors. Nobody really knows what is happening. It's all theory.

Of course we can cite data to support certain theories, but they remain theories. What happens if Trenberth's short term cooling trend turns into a long one? Maybe it's a new ice age we're facing and not a meltdown. Previous ice ages were preceded by short periods of increased warming...not that I'm predicting an ice age this time.

Nevertheless it makes common sense to promote and develop clean environmental policies and technology. Goes without saying. It's stupid to piss in your own beer.

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