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June 30, 2020

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"Hence all the fake Mars Missions"

7,

Fake? How so?

I don’t know if there is a hell or not and neither do you. What I do know is that people can create their own hell in their own minds right here on earth.

I don’t know if there as demons or hobgoblins or flying elephants and unicorns 🦄, but neither do you or manjit. Just because you can imagine something doesn’t make it true.

What I struggle to comprehend is attacking a belief system that shares many of its principles with Buddhism and other wisdom traditions that seem to be considered fine by the supposed atheists on this site. So why should rssb be poo-poo’d? It’s as stupid as a catholic telling a ptirtestabt or Muslim that his beliefs are stupid. No perspective.

Hey Tim,

Yes, I don’t mean to be the devil, but it seems that might be my lot. I will try be more clear on manjit’s BS but there’s so much of it, I’m not sure where to start. Only my opinion. If others believe it is not BS or like his BS, I got no problem with it, I just have to call BS when I see it. Manjit said he doesn’t mind so we are all happy.

I would tend to agree with you that certain of the principles seem to be quite punitive, much like various religions, but I’m not sure that is the essential teaching.

I’m wondering if that punitive interpretation is how it’s been set out in books. For example, if karma is true, then it’s not punitive so much as a natural law of the universe, If you do good you will receive good. If you do bad, you will receive bad. As you sow so shall you reap. So it could be considered punitive in the negative punishment sense, but it could also be considered rewarding. Or it could be considered as morally neutral - it’s just you will get back whatever you put out.

This could even be expressed scientifically, for every reaction, you get an equal yet opposite reaction.

So the notion of karma is a complex one. I don’t think manjit is any position to understand what the guru’s understanding of karma is. Yes he may have read about karma in a book from an rssb Satsangi or even an exer like Hinesey who write ‘life is fair’ but this doesn’t mean these books / sabtagi’s view of karma is right or the whole story or what the guru understands karma to be.

Georgy,

You wrote:
“I don’t know if there is a hell or not and neither do you. What I do know is that people can create their own hell in their own minds right here on earth.

I don’t know if there as demons or hobgoblins or flying elephants and unicorns 🦄, but neither do you or manjit. Just because you can imagine something doesn’t make it true.

What I struggle to comprehend is attacking a belief system that shares many of its principles with Buddhism and other wisdom traditions that seem to be considered fine by the supposed atheists on this site. So why should rssb be poo-poo’d? It’s as stupid as a catholic telling a ptirtestabt or Muslim that his beliefs are stupid. No perspective.“

Me:
I honestly can’t tell if any of that was in response to my recent comments since you didn’t address anyone.

In my recent comments I wasn’t criticizing RSSB. I’m sorry you weren’t able to see that.
*************

You wrote:
“Just because you can imagine it doesn’t make it true.”

Me: (put a little differently)
If you can imagine it you can experience it. It doesn’t make it “Real” but it does make it “real” for the individual.

(I’m referring to the subjective nature of the imagination.)


Also, if you don’t stop taking every comment about RSSB and GSD so personally and in such a paranoid manner then I’m going to have to assume you wish to be the guru.

@anami
Blue rat. Funny.

@Georgy
Again, you filter everything I write through your extremely emotionally charged field of paranoia. You’re wrong about most everything I write.

@777
You wrote:
“I had a friend who had many books even so that he had to buy 2 extra houses to stock all them
He read them all
Once I said
but if you know all there is written, . . . how about a zillion of other planets with their knowledge?
Same with meditation - best is to do it to let your Love swell”

Me:
Wow! 😳 Bibiohoarder!
Yes, ultimately it’s about experience/meditation. 🙂

So the notion of karma is a complex one. I don’t think manjit is any position to understand what the guru’s understanding of karma is. Yes he may have read about karma in a book from an rssb Satsangi or even an exer like Hinesey who write ‘life is fair’ but this doesn’t mean these books / sabtagi’s view of karma is right or the whole story or what the guru understands karma to be.

Posted by: Georgy Porgy | July 09, 2020 at 05:28 AM

And how exactly is it that YOU understand what the guru understands karma to be?

Are you completely delusional??? Do you actually believe yourself to be Gurinder??? I’m starting to think you need some SERIOUS psychological help.

It’s the guru’s responsibility to approve all books published under RSSB.

Did they stop publishing the English Q&A sessions?

Is it because of the red candles? Shame.

Sadly the only pro RSSB person on this site that is actually setting a good example is 777.

@manjit

The nootropics are working wonders. They seem to be countering all the negative side effects of the 6 different allopathic meds I take that over time impair cognitive function.

I have been taking doctor prescribed Klonipin every day twice a day for 16+ years which has the side effects equivalent to smoking weed every day.

It already feels like I can think clearer in the sense that I’m more decisive and can prioritize better.

What is it with Satsangis? My husband never told me he was a Satsangi or ANYTHING about RSSB until after we were married. That seems some deceitful to me. I would never have married him if I had know despite the fact that it has made him a better person than he would be without some sort of purpose in life.

I just don’t like being lied to. And I think that to lie about your Faith is the worst lie a person can tell. How can you ever trust a person that can’t even be honest about their belief in and commitment to a particular faith?

Hi S
You have a reason of signing with Sonia and next with S ?
Like I do with the seven

OK Anami
My impression , just one 7
@Brian don't simran_ize these horrific death thoughst to heavy
You are not 100% sure, not even 5%

777

I’m disgusted with myself.

I spent this evening going through the archives and reading all the old comments from that last two years. Clearly I am stupidly naive and way too nice. 🤮

Yuck. Yuck. Yuck.

Found this too:

Yep, alcohol is probably the worst of the lot, but it can also make for a v pleasant experience or night out. I don’t drink during the week, but can happily sink 10 or more pints if I go out with pals. In fact it’s nice every couple of months to have a rip-snorter and blast the grey cells into oblivion. Probably not good, but the pub can be one of the nice things about the pommie / European culture imo. But yeah luckily I ain’t really been tempted to suck on the bottle regular each day like some who think it’s mother’s milk.


Posted by: Georgy Porgy | December 17, 2019 at 04:34 AM

@7

Just like you... I get tired of spelling my whole name out sometimes.

Who are Georgey and Ashy. Just read a post from 2009. Georgey (with an e) shares a lot in common with the current Georgy as far as background goes. But Ashy talks more like him and Whodunit and Ilanovitch.

Just curious... there’s so much. It’s hard to keep up.

Emerging from meditation, it's interesting to note how much time we spend trying to figure out what's what with these tiny brains. We are extremely limited in our capacity to reason. Of course we should use reason and fact as much as possible, but there is still much we don't know. And with these highly limited thinking machines we will never get beyond opinions however much we try to base those on solid information. And we spend so much time trying to express our opinions to each other. And then they will never match, so there is conflict and debate. The whole process is extremely derivative, third and forth hand. We feel confirmed when others agree, validated. And we feel threatened when others disagree. This is a terribly inefficient source of happiness and we'll - being. Yet opinions are senseless. It's irrational.
We worry about things that are largely or entirely our interpretation and always partial understanding, and that means partial misunderstanding.

We have to function in this world, and so the process is necessary. But like clothes or food, we can get caught up in it when it isn't really exercising our main capacity to find and grow happiness that is uncomplicated and uncompromised within ourselves.

A moment spent in opinion is another moment spent outside of direct experience of ourselves, and the natural bliss that comes with it.

And that is always there within available as direct experience, no opinions needed. No conflict, no pain, but awareness.

A moment spent in opinion is another moment spent outside of direct experience of ourselves, and the natural bliss that comes with it.

And that is always there within available as direct experience, no opinions needed. No conflict, no pain, but awareness.

Posted by: Spence Tepper | July 10, 2020 at 04:11 AM

Questioning and expressing opinions as opposed to just preaching or blindly believing are also part of the journey to self-discovery.

I’m not a guru and I don’t want to follow any false gurus.

Not everyone has your best interest at heart. It’s important to remember that in this world.

There seems to be a new movement among spiritual groups today that “evil” isn’t real.

How do you define evil?

Do atheists believe evil exists?

What is the source of evil?

If you don’t believe in demons then obviously you don’t believe in God beyond a Buddhist perspective.

GSD is a Buddhist. And there’s nothing wrong with that. I just don’t think that the majority of Satsangis today are aware of that.

Planet of the Apes!
https://greece.greekreporter.com/2020/07/10/hominid-footprints-on-crete-could-change-evolutionary-theory-for-good/

OMG, this totally made my day.

https://youtu.be/kELDEdMbkyg

🤣

Planet of the Apes!
https://greece.greekreporter.com/2020/07/10/hominid-footprints-on-crete-could-change-evolutionary-theory-for-good/

Posted by: anami | July 10, 2020 at 09:06 AM

Wow, that’s pretty cool. 🤓

With regards to your earlier question about whether RSSB believes in evolution, I was at a satsang weekend in Petaluma where GSD said “we believe in evolution” followed by what seemed logical, obvious reasoning. But then when I asked him about it at Dera during Q&A he said, “Did I say that? I don’t remember that... I wish someone would record what I say (meaning his team).”

So, the answer is I don’t know... I personally don’t see any conflict between evolution and “Superconsciousness” together creating/evolving into the world we live in.

Just don’t understand why people can’t believe in both super consciousness and evolution. They don’t seem to conflict imo. (Not sure if the term “higher power” really makes sense anymore.)

But the link I included in the previous comment (SNL) might be the real truth. ;)

I’m sure the truth is out there... somewhere.

Also, didn’t realize the NSA was handling all the X-files these days. That explains a lot. 😆

OK, best day all week. 😂 😂😂
https://youtu.be/PfPdYYsEfAE

"I personally don’t see any conflict between evolution and “Superconsciousness” together creating/evolving into the world we live in."

Sonia,

Me neither, but I wondered whether manjit had the scholarly perspective on Darwinism and Sant Mat. I should check Radhasoami Reality and see if Mark Juergensmeyer had anything to say.

I think the main reason creationists get upset with evolution is that it contradicts the Bible on page 1. What's left but to deny science altogether? Seen any of that lately?

Radha Soami Reality? Wait, there are more sites about RS out there besides RSSB.com and this one? 🤔

Here are some more laughs from Key Peele. Love these guys.
https://youtu.be/IHfiMoJUDVQ

Going to start ‘Stateless’ later tonight.

anami,

Here we go... this is probably as close to the truth as you’re ever going to get.
https://youtu.be/-ARFzXso3Ns


And to summarize and tie pretty much everything together that you read on these threads is this. https://youtu.be/ZxeghzvcO3Q

GSD is a Buddhist. And there’s nothing wrong with that. I just don’t think that the majority of Satsangis today are aware of that.

Posted by: S | July 10, 2020 at 06:50 AM

😳 I thought he was Sikh?

GSD is a Buddhist. And there’s nothing wrong with that. I just don’t think that the majority of Satsangis today are aware of that.

Posted by: S | July 10, 2020 at 06:50 AM

😳 I thought he was Sikh?

Posted by: Amiconfused | July 10, 2020 at 01:40 PM

Noooo. (And yes, you are confused.) He’s not a Sikh. I’ve never understood the turban and beard thing other than I guess it makes him look more like a “holy man”. None of the Masters were Sikhs. RS is an offshoot of Sikhism and Hinduism and Sufism combined. But RSSB today has evolved to be more Buddhist than anything else. GSD loves his Buddha statues.

The Masters didn’t follow the Sikh religion. They followed Sant Mat Radhasoami. The Sikh connection is more cultural heritage. It’s like a person with Jewish ancestry being a Christian. They’re Jewish but they don’t follow Judaism. I hope that clears things up.

Wearing the turban and not cutting the beard are for religious reasons. Shiv Dayal didn’t wear a turban. It’s not necessary for them to do so. They just do.

I doubt the next master will don the turban, unless Shivinder is the next master. I’m pretty sure he’d go with the look. But GSD’s son doesn’t wear a turban. He looks Western.

Sonia so I guess you are referring to what the master follows. If you go by that then the master follows love. Love is his religion. Love should be our religion too.
By Sikh I meant born into a Sikh religion and culture.

Hey, Sonia.

I usually skip the video links, but "prophetic and all knowing TSA" was kinda funny. SNL I'd already seen. I liked your robin and dog clip too.

Radhasoami Reality: The Logic of a Modern Faith is a book. A study published in 1991.

How do you figure GSD is a Buddhist???

Sonia so I guess you are referring to what the master follows. If you go by that then the master follows love. Love is his religion. Love should be our religion too.
By Sikh I meant born into a Sikh religion and culture.

Posted by: Amiconfused | July 10, 2020 at 05:41 PM

Love. That’s a funny word. I don’t even know what love is anymore. Seems all the organizations in this world are made up of greed, lust, and desire for power.

@anami

Aww 😊 thx. Marshall is a sweetheart.

Yeah, Key & Peele are kind of hit and miss. Half their stuff is hilarious and half is kinda stupid. That was one of the better ones.


Sorry, that comment was a bit of a downer. I just ended episode 3 of Stateless. (It’s Friday and everybody’s out.)

After episode 1 I lost my sense of humor. After episode 3 I was crying.

I meant to address that to amiconfused—the response about my comment (about love) being a downer. But Stateless is a really good show. Inspired by true events. Immigration system seems to be broken almost everywhere in the world.

Ahh... so much better than the red candles. ❤️ 🦢

Very good Tim Rimmer!!
I feel it the same about Santmat.
Thanks for your explaining how you see things in that context..

Forgiveness is an interesting thing. Forgiveness is more for the forgiver than for the one asking (or not asking for forgiveness). Forgiveness is how we heal ourselves. That persons who you’ve imagined hurt you doesn’t “need” your forgiveness. Forgiveness is how we heal ourselves and free ourselves. It’s kind of ironic.

Forgiveness and discipline aren’t the same. You can always forgive but if the person does keep repeating the same behavior then discipline is required. And discipline from a parent’s perspective should always be looked at as teaching, not punishment. We don’t punish for the sake of hurting. Parents discipline for the sake of teaching so that they can help the child learn to do the right thing. Sometimes “punishment” is simply whatever is required to “motivate” a child to stop the negative behavior so that they don’t damage themselves or others. It’s to teach them understanding. Or at least try...

Punishment purely for the sake of punishment is called torture. Nature has laws that we can’t circumvent. You can’t jump off a building without hurting yourself. Everything has consequences. So, there’s no need for retribution since nature/cause and effect is going to provide that automatically. Discipline is simply a form of teaching that helps the individual not break the laws of nature so that they can avoid creating negative circumstances for themselves and others.

It’s all about love. (I’m back on love today.)

The same applies to varying degrees when working with family, friends and colleagues. We should think less in punitive terms and more in Teaching terms.

(That was my personal lesson for myself for the day so I’m not preaching, just thought I’d share what I learned.)

"Parents discipline for the sake of teaching so that they can help the child learn to do the right thing."

I never used punishment with my three sons and they turned out to be very positive and understanding people. Communication is the answer. Right from when they are old enough to understand what you are saying to them. My youngest had a fiery attitude and from the age of two or three years old he used to get really upset and would stand with his hands on his hips and say "you're not the boss of me, no ones the boss of me". For some reason I loved him even more than ever and having been a timid child myself I just loved him so much and would talk gently and calmly with him. Did not need to punish him and I knew this because I have strong empathy. He joined Scouts and Venturers when he was young and is now the most gracious and kind person and a Scout and Venturer leader with the patience of a saint. My parents were never disciplinarian and never tried to teach my brother and I and we became our own independent selves. My brother (seven years older than me) hitchhiked around the world in the sixties and seventies and visited the Dera and came home and told us about it and my mother and myself also became satsangis.

Yes Sonia, It is all about love.

Jen, no doubt you’re an excellent mom. It’s obvious and you’re very blessed to have your three sons still close and caring. Sounds like they’re taking good care of you. 😊

Georgy,

The only reason I ever apologize to you is because I start to feel sorry for you from time to time. It’s more than obvious you’re hurting.

For the record, I don’t care what you think of me but I do feel bad for you... whatever it is you’re going through.

As far as suicide goes... this isn’t going to help much but GSD says the day of your birth and the day of one’s death are predetermined. So, regardless of how one dies, they were destined to leave this world that day. This may just be a small comfort. But I find it comforting, nonetheless. I don’t know anyone personally or even distantly related to me who has committed suicide. However, I have seen the grief it causes families. I think anger is a natural part of the grieving process but just understanding that a person’s death is predetermined is strangely somehow more comforting.

Not comforting in the “how they died” sense. Just comforting in that it helps you let go of thinking that you should have had more time with them. Some people suffer for many years through a physical illness before they die. And that’s a terrible thing to watch.

It’s a very sensitive subject indeed. But accepting that one has to leave this world on a specific day somehow makes it easier to let go. Helps in letting go of the shoulda, coulda, woulda thoughts. 🙁

Letting go of someone or something you have no control over is peaceful. But it’s very difficult getting to that point.

Can anyone tell me what the feeling is like to be wrong all the time? I notice a few of you who exist in some sort of state of constant clinging to popular ideas and beliefs, and it makes you wrong basically all the time.

What does being wrong about everything feel like? What's it like to actually believe in the cult's teachings?

Can anyone tell me what the feeling is like to be wrong all the time? I notice a few of you who exist in some sort of state of constant clinging to popular ideas and beliefs, and it makes you wrong basically all the time.

What does being wrong about everything feel like? What's it like to actually believe in the cult's teachings?

Posted by: Jesse | July 12, 2020 at 07:17 PM

😂😂😂

I don’t know, Jesse. What does being Right all the time feel like?

I honestly don’t care either way. If I’m wrong, so what? If you’re wrong, so what? If everyone else is wrong, so what?

We’re only expressing and debating opinions here. I don’t think any of us have day jobs as policy makers. (Although I might be wrong about that since I have no idea what any of you actually do for a living other than Spence.)

Welcome to the Great Debate. Is there a God or isn’t there? Is there life after death or not? Is Trump a stable genius or a narcissistic sociopath? Is RSSB some evil cult or just simply an a organic spiritual philosophy evolving with the rest of humanity. Which is better, DC or Marvel?

Sonia my understanding of what the master explains is that the time
Of birth and death are written however suicide is when a person takes these matters in their own hands and alters destiny. This is why it’s explained to be the biggest sin in all teachings because it is going against the law of nature...against the divine will.
Your life circumstances are presented to you by virtue of where life brings you but how you deal with them or react to them is your free will.
Master was asked once that we are taught that need to learn to live in the lords will then what is suicide? His answer: not living in his will.

That’s the way I understand it

Can anyone tell me what the feeling is like to be wrong all the time? I notice a few of you who exist in some sort of state of constant clinging to popular ideas and beliefs, and it makes you wrong basically all the time.

What does being wrong about everything feel like? What's it like to actually believe in the cult's teachings?

Posted by: Jesse | July 12, 2020 at 07:17 PM

😂😂😂

I don’t know, Jesse. What does being right all the time feel like?

I honestly don’t care either way. If I’m wrong, so what? If you’re wrong, so what? If everyone else is wrong, so what?

We’re only expressing and debating opinions here. I don’t think any of us have day jobs as policy makers. (Although I might be wrong about that since I have no idea what any of you actually do for a living other than Spence.)

Welcome to the Great Debate. Is there a God or isn’t there? Is there life after death or not? Is Trump a stable genius or a narcissistic sociopath? Is RSSB some evil cult or just simply an a organic spiritual philosophy evolving with the rest of humanity. DC or Marvel?

I’ll just add, it must be a huge burden to bare—being the only one, the Lonely one who holds the key to true knowledge.

You’re like some kind of Oracle.

Sonia my understanding of what the master explains is that the time
Of birth and death are written however suicide is when a person takes these matters in their own hands and alters destiny. This is why it’s explained to be the biggest sin in all teachings because it is going against the law of nature...against the divine will.
Your life circumstances are presented to you by virtue of where life brings you but how you deal with them or react to them is your free will.
Master was asked once that we are taught that need to learn to live in the lords will then what is suicide? His answer: not living in his will.

That’s the way I understand it

Posted by: Amiconfused | July 12, 2020 at 10:34 PM

Hmmm 🧐

Well, I’ll just add that to the list of questions I’ll never get to ask him.

Too bad he doesn’t do virtual Q&A.

Although, it’s not like I really want to ask him another question about suicide. The last time I did, things didn’t go so well... which is why I’m here.

I guess the bottom line is try not to get so depressed that you commit suicide. Or don’t commit suicide. Either way is a pretty depressing subject. But I don’t think it’s worse than committing murder. I’m pretty sure killing another person isn’t in the Lord’s will either. If your gonna follow that kind of logic...

Sonia my understanding of what the master explains is that the time
Of birth and death are written however suicide is when a person takes these matters in their own hands and alters destiny. This is why it’s explained to be the biggest sin in all teachings because it is going against the law of nature...against the divine will.
Your life circumstances are presented to you by virtue of where life brings you but how you deal with them or react to them is your free will.
Master was asked once that we are taught that need to learn to live in the lords will then what is suicide? His answer: not living in his will.

That’s the way I understand it

Posted by: Amiconfused | July 12, 2020 at 10:34 PM

It’s a dark and depressing subject all the way around. Sometimes I wonder why my life was spared both times when I tried to commit suicide (again, this was over 20 years ago). I certainly wasn’t “crying for help” and anyone else who did what I did most definitely wouldn’t be alive today. It can only be described as a miracle. Both times—a total miracle. It defies science that I’m alive. So, why was my life spared or saved when others aren’t? My loved ones don’t have to ask all those horrible questions that others do. I’m so grateful for that, and my question to GSD was about the possible “guilt” I had over those two attempts. He did say nothing happens to the soul when someone commits suicide, that it’s just the mind. (Then he said depression is a first world problem but I’m not upset about that. 😂) And I don’t mean that “I’m here” because I’m upset or anything. It’s just what he said to me—that whole experience actually helped me to look at things differently and to open my mind and question all the things that I believed to be true but weren’t necessarily true. It helped me to search for the answer to what is true Love.

That’s all... no hard feelings. Of course, I have the clarity of mind now to see that in many cases it is unimaginably painful for those left behind. I mean, what kind of karma do those people have to ever have to go through something like that? (If you believe in karma.)

Suicide.

When I'm GIHF, my answer will be something like, "It doesn't solve anything, because our karmas only follow us into the next life, and you'll have it even worse, because the act of suicide adds to the burden. Your impulse to self-obliterate can be channeled into meditation. Meditation is the art of dying, a dress rehearsal to master the stages and journey of death while still in the body. Terminating the physical life prematurely, you'd be wasting an incredible opportunity and setting yourself back. Meditation burns karma and will lighten the burden you feel now to be straining under. Besides, the inner worlds are beyond description, and you'll forget all your troubles. Die daily in meditation."

How's that?

Suicide.

When I'm GIHF, my answer will be something like, "It doesn't solve anything, because our karmas only follow us into the next life, and you'll have it even worse, because the act of suicide adds to the burden. Your impulse to self-obliterate can be channeled into meditation. Meditation is the art of dying, a dress rehearsal to master the stages and journey of death while still in the body. Terminating the physical life prematurely, you'd be wasting an incredible opportunity and setting yourself back. Meditation burns karma and will lighten the burden you feel now to be straining under. Besides, the inner worlds are beyond description, and you'll forget all your troubles. Die daily in meditation."

How's that?

Posted by: anami | July 13, 2020 at 07:12 AM

Wow. No apprenticeship needed for you. That’s pretty good!

Especially this part:
“Besides, the inner worlds are beyond description, and you'll forget all your troubles. Die daily in meditation."”

That’s pretty brilliant.

On another note, we’ve still got a serious timeline issue. Math is my Achilles heel so maybe you can help me out with this.

1. The day you were born and the day you die are predestined.

2. However, if you commit suicide then you’ve superseded predestination.

3. Where do you go in between the time of your death not recorded or prepared for in the Book of Life?

4. What happens if you were supposed to be the biological parent of another soul destined to be born after your premature death (suicide) but before your real earthly death that was recorded in the book of life?

5. The Book of Life—how often are they having to amend and update it?

6. How can two major events that are completely dependent upon every other event—even the tiniest of events—actually be predestined without every other event being predestined?

7. Is the answer to 1-6 “The Adjustment Bureau? If so, then I have no further questions.

But, GSD, made a good point in the last video where he was sitting outside (and the birds were chirping—that was super cute 😊) that these are probably the most asked questions and most difficult to understand (very loosely paraphrasing).

When I try to do the “math”, I realize what a futile exercise it all is... but the futility of it is exactly what makes everything else seem futile unless you just believe in something very general like Love.

I really enjoy watching the Q&A videos. They provide a lot of food for thought. The one with the comment about suicide stirred up some negative emotions but it ultimately helped me look at it from a different perspective. It can’t be said enough what a sensitive subject it is. There’s almost no way to talk about it without someone getting upset.

Anyway, since the Dera is closed through December 2020 people—mostly Satsangis—are really looking forward to his Q&As.

I’m not anti Sant Mat and I’m certainly not anti GSD—not by a long shot. But there are aspects of RS teachings (especially the traditional ones) that just don’t quite make sense to me. I’m not alone in that.

Maybe ultimately Spirituality isn’t supposed to make sense.

Gdam I see we are stil on this happiest of topics. So much for fun crazy. I wish that were the case.

Gdam I see we are stil on this happiest of topics. So much for fun crazy. I wish that were the case.

Posted by: Georgy Porgy | July 13, 2020 at 01:18 PM

Every time I see a comment from you it’s like walking into my office and finding a surprise bouquet of flowers on my desk.

Georgy, I’m way more fun than you. I know that’s difficult for you to process but the sooner you learn to accept it the sooner you won’t feel the need to attack me.

Sorry, I’m just cooler than you.

😂

There’s almost no way to talk about it without someone getting upset

I's always wrong to kill an innocent one ( the body )
while one hates the mind
A better way to punish the mind is to stop it's repetitions
Simran does that
pjus produces gorgeous vibrations 🌞

Have a try

777

"Maybe ultimately Spirituality isn’t supposed to make sense."

Nothing makes sense. We have five senses and supposedly a sixth sense, which I think is probably wishful thinking. Rather trying to make sense of life or death probably better to accept that we really don't have any answers to life and the supposed life after death.

Believe in enlightenment? What does that even mean? Thats also a kind of hallucination. How can we prove its real even if we have out of body experiences which are still created by the brain. Its also easy to believe that our soul is experiencing inner journeys but how can we prove these experiences are real and that we are not simply dreaming.

Is our life simply some kind of dream and when we die thats it, over and done with? Well, we won't know until after we are dead. I have a strange sense of humour nowadays. How to live without expectations? Just living each day and not trying to figure what life is all about, letting go and being free from all beliefs...

"That’s pretty brilliant.

On another note, we’ve still got a serious timeline issue. Math is my Achilles heel so maybe you can help me out with this."

Sonia,

Well, no. The destiny question is beyond me. I constructed the suicide statement from book learning. Weren't most of my formulations standard Sant Mat? Aren't they standard anymore?

Is our life simply some kind of dream and when we die thats it, over and done with? Well, we won't know until after we are dead. I have a strange sense of humour nowadays. How to live without expectations? Just living each day and not trying to figure what life is all about, letting go and being free from all beliefs...

Posted by: Jen | July 13, 2020 at 05:33 PM

I really appreciate your perspective. I like talking to people who have lived longer than I have and have more experience. I’ve never met anyone (who uses their grey matter) who at the end of their life says I’ve got it all figured out. You meet people that seem really at peace and that’s about as close to enlightened as it gets. Even if they can’t give you all the answers you’re looking for.

Maybe I’ll try to go a week without thinking about this stuff... without trying make sense of it.

I's always wrong to kill an innocent one ( the body )
while one hates the mind
A better way to punish the mind is to stop it's repetitions
Simran does that
pjus produces gorgeous vibrations 🌞

Have a try

777

Posted by: 🌞🌞🌞 | July 13, 2020 at 04:35 PM

Good intentions. Simran helps some people. And then some people really do need professional help.

********************

Well, no. The destiny question is beyond me. I constructed the suicide statement from book learning. Weren't most of my formulations standard Sant Mat? Aren't they standard anymore?

Posted by: anami | July 13, 2020 at 08:02 PM

Yeah, all of those are standard Sant Mat. But again, when a person is that far gone they’re no where near traveling the inner regions.

Maybe I’ll just keep this suicide conversion going till Georgy mentally implodes.

conversation not “conversion”

Sonia,

Okay, I've got it. Here's my holy man answer to your questions about predestination:

"Quantum phenomena can not be understood in Newtonian terms."

"Quantum phenomena can not be understood in Newtonian terms."

Posted by: anami | July 14, 2020 at 07:42 AM

Perfect. 👌 Love it. I’ll use that one going forward for anything impossible to explain. 😁

@ Okay, I've got it. Here's my holy man answer to your questions about
@ predestination:
@ "Quantum phenomena can not be understood in Newtonian terms."

I like it! But can I be wholly sure Newton's apple was on the
ground before it fell. Holy moly, that's the fruit of thought.

Am I predestined to confuse myself. Of course... unless I
wholly become the apple. Otherwise, the core is left.


Man this guy makes a lot of sense.

I mean compare this to bullshit hyperfalutin analysis of these Buddhist masters. This is just plain talk. Clear as day. If there is someone that can express these incredibly deep concepts any more clearly I’ve yet to see it.

Where is all this religiosity like GIHF that everyone on here consistently bangs on about like a bunch of rabid jackals?

Just clear wize words.

Long live the magnificent 7

Posted by: Georgy Porgy | July 15, 2020 at 03:58 AM

GIHF is the mantra of every satsangi at every Satsang ever. But you wouldn’t know that since your only involvement with Sant Mat is trolling this blog.

Maybe you should look for a spiritual philosophy that’s all about division since divisiveness is your forte.

Gurunder says . . . . .

You are certainly going to use this against my 400+ comments
stating that only LOVE will end separation

I guess ; and no satguru ever said : You MUST love ME.
I said that "thinking nothing" will provoke this love
but that LOVE will actively stop our inner dialogue
and that each puber knows this
"Cannot speak, cannot eat, cannot sleep!"

The ADvaita reasoning cannot do a thing but powerfull Simran will do it because in that package is the solution ; is The Love
Simran IS the Super de Luxe if done at ALL TIMES, 24/7

HE, Gurinder is The Custodian of that Simran Package
but HE doesn't place Himself above us, prefers let me say that


I completely agree with HIM and sympathise with Him

This morning a RSSB booklet "RAVIDAS" came 2me
and I read on page 100 about the value of the 7 chakra system
that makes one ONE
Again Anami, 4 Billions ago it started
and a whole 7 chakra civilisation was saved
They left genetic material and so Jaimalsaid
an earlier time I was here the Himalayas were not

Now Aliens are flabbergasted about how to enter in a 7 chakra jevaa
without proper reincarnation
The 7 Chakra individual can generate Love
and also Hate

LOVE does it . . . ask for it . . . that s not to much to ask
in your contemplations

777


Georgy, do you know a single person in real life who is a Satsangi? Have you ever attended a satsang at a local sangat? Have you read ANY of the RSSB books? Never been to Dera? Never applied for initiation? Obviously never sat in meditation. Do you know anything at all about any of the previous Masters? Can you even name one of the previous Masters? Do you realize that all you do is make people not want to have anything to do with the guru? Or is that your whole purpose?

Georgy, do you know a single person in real life who is a Satsangi? Have you ever attended a satsang at a local sangat? Have you read ANY of the RSSB books? Never been to Dera? Never applied for initiation? Obviously never sat in meditation. Do you know anything at all about any of the previous Masters? Can you even name one of the previous Masters? Do you realize that all you do is make people not want to have anything to do with the guru? Or is that your whole purpose?

Posted by: S | July 15, 2020 at 08:04 AM

OK, I think I figured it out. You’re commenting from a Correctional facility in the U.K. You’re in there because you used your two Science degrees to go all Walter White Breaking Bad. And you saw GSD once before you went so he’s your only hope and inspiration.

I get it now. I’m so sorry. You’re doing the best you can. I’m not even being sarcastic.

I’ll try to be more understanding from now on.

Georgy, I’m neurotic. I worry a lot. I’ve never been able to figure you out and you really rub me the wrong way a lot of times because I have no idea where you’re coming from because your whole background makes what you do and say very conflicting. However, it’s really none of my business what your background is or whatever you’re dealing with. But then I sit and worry that I’ve been too harsh with you and maybe you really are locked up (which is totally cool—I mean, no judgement). And then I think, damn, I hope he has access to books, and people who visit him and write him.

See, I’m THAT kind of neurotic. I guess the bottom line is I shouldn’t judge you because I have no idea what you’ve been through or how difficult your circumstances may or may not be.

You’re OK.

Sonia, you are not neurotic.

Georgy is very judgmental and thinks he knows everything. I'm sick of being judged by the country I was born in and the colour of my skin. I'm not at all nostalgic. I'm very grateful to have escaped.

This is a comment from him to me:

"South Africa’s apartheid regime was legal racism, it was despicable. There is and never will be any defense for it. Much of the violent crime that ensued abd exists to this day was a direct result of racial oppression. Guess what human beings don’t like being mistreated. There is a reason why people from other countries are weary of white South Africans who did a runner, especially those who feel nostalgic to that era."

Posted by: Georgy Porgy | June 06, 2020 at 11:32 PM

@Jen

I remember when Georgy wrote that. At the time I was like surely he’s not referring to Jen. If he read anything you’ve ever written he couldn’t possibly be referring to you.

Of course, I know what he said is the farthest thing from the truth about you. You’ve made that very clear in all your comments.

My mother-in-law and brother-in-law are still trapped there. We have to send them money to cover all of their expenses every month because there’s such chaos in the country, xenophobia and reverse discrimination that it’s almost impossible for a white person to get employment there.

Anyway, sad thing is they are Satsangis and completely against any sort of racist thinking or treatment of others.

You are so lucky to have escaped. I’m so happy for you. It’s absolute hell there.

Georgy might actually be South African. I just say that based on a lot of his references. With proxy servers we will never know...

"You are so lucky to have escaped. I’m so happy for you. It’s absolute hell there."

Thank you Sonia, so glad someone understands. Its horrible being judged and I suppose thats why I live a very quiet life, just keeping to myself and my family. Sorry to hear that your mother-in-law and brother-in-law are still there. Not easy now with the high levels of violent crime.

yes, I am judging the South African apartheid regime, as I would the German Nazi regime, or any other government that would oppress and treat ppl differently based on colour, creed, health, sex, sexual orientation, or anything else.

I believe it is right and necessary to speak out when there is injustice in this world.

If you have a problem with any of that - tough titty.

Why is it ppl take a general comment so personally. Where did I insult Jen? I made a general comment in a BLM discussion thread.

If Jen take it personally, it says more about Jen than anything else.

As for my take on old SA, which is now long gone thank god, is that the people that voted for that regime (the overwhelming white majority) are equally to blame.

I would go further, though this is more debatable and my own view, which is that any white SA expat sitting in the lap of luxury in their foreign hidey holes, should be less concerned about their own shaming by foreigners, and more concerned about the people that were ‘properly’ persecuted under those regimes. Do you actually know what true persecution is? How selfish and obtuse can one actually be?

I hate to break it to you, but there are many South Africans who believe it or not find the current country and government infinitely better than any white-racist government that ever existed before. Why do they want to hear from embittered expats? If you not part of the solution, just fk off and leave already and stay gone.

There are many issues with the current SA govt, of which their current citizens should all have a say, but I’ve got no time at all for eye is me embittered SA expats who should accept their new country and have no say in the current SA country or govt at all.

https://www.classcentral.com/tag/interpersonal-skills

I’ll be happy to buy this course for you.
https://www.udemy.com/course/interpersonal-relationships-u/

Jen,

Just ignore Georgy. He hasn’t been getting any yard time lately.

Oh sorry I thought you wanted me to comment.

Would you prefer it if I was false and feigned kissy-kissy koochy-ku kumbaya compassion for all the crazy fun suicidals, alcoholics and expat white South Africans ?

Is that what normal well-adjusted ppl like you do. Feign sympathy.

Sorry I can’t do that.

Georgy Porgy, would you prefer that I ignored the fact that you act like a troll who is just trying to stir things up on my blog, insult people, and denigrate serious problems like alcoholism and suicidal thoughts? Sorry, I can't do that. Any further comments from you won't be published.

And if you use a different "name" in a cowardly attempt to keep on disguising your identity as a troll, rest assured that no comments will be published that are as nasty as the ones you've been trying to share -- some of which I've already refused to publish. There's a lot of room in cyberspace. I look forward to you finding another place to spew your hate speech.

Oh sorry I thought you wanted me to comment.

Would you prefer it if I was false and feigned kissy-kissy koochy-ku kumbaya compassion for all the crazy fun suicidals, alcoholics and expat white South Africans ?

Is that what normal well-adjusted ppl like you do. Feign sympathy.

Sorry I can’t do that.

Posted by: Georgy Porgy | July 16, 2020 at 11:21 AM

No, Guruji, I really just wanted you to actually have empathy.

Osho saidHow can “doing” anything get you to oneness, when “you” are the doer?
Anything that makes you proud enhances the ego and the “me”

I VERY MUCH AGREE

SO, fall in Love
we can ask
just ask

777

Love the Lamborghini!

@all even exers

This is a small lesson about "non thinking"

Although the ultimate way is LOVE
there are some short cuts

Make a little list of 5 or 3 horrible events you heard or experienced
that you would never remember anymore at all in your life.

But this is for a good purpose - maybe it works also with minor "calamities"

So please before sitting read one random page or strophe
from a RSSB book

Now when sitting remember N° One and because you have told yourself not to remember perhaps half your life
it will be easy to terminate that thought stream or dialogue

Next realise about HOW you did it

The point is:
When you r capable to short_circuit that big one , . . . use your method for
other less frightening daily streams
IT WILL WORK

THIS IS THE TIME OF STREAMING

777

PS
Not changing the notles from initiation but can be fun
Like typing the 5 words 1,000 times on your computer - next wipe it

Posted by: 💞💋🧡🧡 FUN 💞💋🧡🧡 Help 💞💋🧡🧡 | July 19, 2020 at 05:39

You’re too nice. :)

Would you prefer it if I was false and feigned kissy-kissy koochy-ku kumbaya compassion for all the crazy fun suicidals, alcoholics and expat white South Africans ?

Is that what normal well-adjusted ppl like you do. Feign sympathy.

Sorry I can’t do that.

Posted by: Georgy Porgy | July 16, 2020 at 11:21 AM

RSSB,

Is this how your guru behaves? That’s not a rhetorical question. I’d really like an answer.

https://www.cnn.com/interactive/2017/10/health/i-on-india-childhood-obesity/

Dera had its fist case of COVID this past week.

I wonder if they closed the snack bar?

Gurinder is older, fatter, balder, slower and sadder. Give him a break for God’s sake...

@This old man
😳 That’s kinda harsh.

@Spence,
Found something you might like.
https://lonerwolf.com/spiritual-guidance/

Hi Sonia,
Thanks for the post. I like it!
It's good to search, until you find your path. Then you search on your path.

Imagine posting with a title "Dalai Lama says we must listen to scientists" and then your next blog post is titled " Blind belief feels good but isn't a reliable guide to truth" and not seeing the irony or thinking of yourself as utterly mentally incapacitated.

You'd be better off in a straight up animal sacrificing cult than the weirdo "believe famous people who use the word science" cult.

Also, just a reminder that you all are always wrong about basically everything.

https://www.mysuncoast.com/2020/07/19/concerns-arise-some-receive-positive-covid-results-never-got-tested/

Gurinder deserves to go to hell.

https://youtu.be/ycTC0YlG1HQ

Blind belief in trillion dollar media conglomerate spin isn't a reliable guide to truth.

https://twitter.com/boriquagato/status/1285566981870161920

Hi Anami! You write: "But what about biological? How old are humans in RS thinking? Did we evolve from apes? Can I go on believing in dinosaurs?" & "A question. What is Sant Mat's position on Darwinism? Has it ever come up? RSSB or other branches?"

"Can I go on believing in dinosaurs" may well be one of the best one liners I have ever read here, thank you :)

Well, one of the questions I held in my mind when I read (and re-read, and re-read again) the entire RSSB corpus as a young teen was, "does any aspect of this cosmology contradict a theory of evolution". I never came across an RS teaching which directly contradicted evolution, and I personally saw no reason for the theory of evolution to "disenchant" one from mysticism and spirituality in general, and it has always seemed to me to be a relic debate within Abrahamic faiths only (where the old creation myth physically contradicts evo)?

So please, feel free to continue believing in dinosaurs. I like to picture them as pink and fluffy with squeaky voices, you?

A problem does arise, however, when we look at old Indic concepts of "yugas", of which we are said to currently be in the "kali yuga". RS doctrine wholesale accepts this model, based as it is on the same Indic metaphysical system, and the fact many proto-RS mystics like those in the Guru Granth Sahib also repeat and believe in the same "yuga" model of creation and life on earth.

The problem is, these cosmo-historic concepts arose and evolved in a context that was notably absent of archaeological digging, comparative analysis of global creation myths, genetic science, physics and astronomical investigations etc, ie. a complete vacuum of real-world facts. With the subsequent tremendous advance in all of these aforementioned fields, it has become abundantly clear that the entire "yuga" model is exceptionally unlikely to be literally physically true. This has led some more modern, "new-age" interpretations of the whole yuga model that is not literal in the sense the originators of these models probably believed them to be. RS doesn't really address the issue, as nobody seems too bothered by that particular mythic aspect of the cosmology, so why spend time rationalising it, I guess?

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Georgy Porgy wrote: "do me a favour and call it for what it is. Manjit said he doesn’t mind, so it’s all good."

Aww, you are so cute Georgy! My heart actually aches for you, that you think there was any possibility on any conceivable level that I could be offended or hurt by your empty criticisms of my post! I'm almost inclined to pretend you make an excellent point just to make you feel better.....if only I wasn't a fan of honesty!! :)

Georgy Porgy wrote: "He seems to be creating an argument that RS considers death to be ‘tortuous’, but where is his evidence for this for a start? And then rambles on about NDEs and child reincarnation. What’s the point?........... I suspect it’s not at all what the rssb/guru believes but what manjit thinks rssb/guru believes."

Hehe....oh dear.

It's somewhat difficult to have serious and sincere discussions with people like yourself, who without having even the slightest idea what they're talking about, seem intent on demanding others share in their absolute and abject ignorance. But worse than this, they lie, distort, deceive and manipulate truth and reality to further their ideological agenda, driven as it is by unexamined and unacknowledged psychological motives. Yes, the religious apologist who defends his faith, even though they have absolutely no idea about their faith, or why they're defending it. And then pretends they have no connection to the religion they are clearly an apologist for. This is a religious psychological dynamic that I have no interest in.

It is clear you have no comprehension of RS history, teachings or cosmology. It is also clear you have no notable grasp or awareness of any field of science, psychology, spirituality, mystical experiences or the paranormal in general. So, naturally, my arguments would have been lost on you as you have no interest in learning or understanding, but instead rather obviously and openly mindlessly and oafishly defending your religion and it's leader. Good luck to you.

On a more pertinent note, should anyone wish to actually learn something, here is Charan Singh's comments about the death process:

"“Q. What about the scorpions?

A. He has given an example to show that you should practice dying while living, because it is easier than the death you have to face at the time of death. At the time of death, the pain that you face is just like the pain of scorpions’ stings so keep that in mind. In order to avoid that pain, now bear this pain of meditation. He has just given this as an example to show generally how much pain we have to go through at the time of death. He says in order to avoid that, a little discomfort now is much better. So we shouldn’t mind this discomfort or pain in the body while sitting at the time of meditation, because otherwise we may have to face that pain of the scorpions. It is just a way of explaining to us.”"
Charan Singh, Die to Live

Now pay attention, folks. What Charan is referring to here, when he describes the death process as if he actually knows what he's talking about, is in response to a questioner's quote from Tulsi Sahib (for people who follow the religion of RS because of familial connections but have no real understanding at all about it's history or teachings, like Georgy Porgy, Tulsi Sahib was Soamiji & his family's guru - PS, Georgy, Soamiji is the founder of the Radhasoami religion you follow, keep up! :). Tulsi Sahib himself, however, was also merely parroting, as if he actually knew what he was talking about, a much older quote from a well known Indic text called the Garuda Purana; "27. Then, at the destruction of the decayed senses and the numbing of the intelligence, the messengers of Yama come near and life departs. 28. When the breath is leaving its place, the moment of dying p. 5 seems an age, and pain like the stinging of hundred scorpions is experienced.".

So, what we have here is a chain of mindless, unexamined intellectual concepts and beliefs - dogma in other words - that is passed from ancient times, via the process of religious "education", to our so called "mystics", who then repeat that exact same, unexamined, dogma as if they are somehow mystically aware of what the death process is like for everyone else who hasn't been initiated into their cult and is able to "die daily" and "withdraw their inner current to the 3rd eye" or whatever other somewhat bat shit crazy religious belief they may hold.

Now, I understand Georgy this is already a bit beyond your level of interest, understanding and awareness of the subject, extended as it has beyond mere mindless religious adherence, defence and apologism - but my earlier point was, the claim has been made by religions past, and via them directly into the mouths of alleged mystics present (heavy emphasis on alleged :) - but what evidence is there to support such a claim? Well, much like all the evidence there has ever been for "reincarnation", all the evidence we have for people who've got close to dying and returned is, well, unaminous; the RS model of both the death process,"reincarnation" and the "afterlife" is total bullshit!

Now, you may, as you do, declare the whole subject evidence-less bullshit! But really, that also includes your guru and his entire religious belief set, for which there is infinitely less "evidence" for their cosmological claims and models than there is for NDErs, child reincarnation memories etc. Simply being entirely ignorant of his entire belief set - having a interest purely for familial psychological religious reasons - does not make it any the less so. But really, good luck with your religion. I hope you find a nice social set to meet up with and share veggie recipes or whatever, and perhaps ease that existential dread you feel. You deserve it, and don't let anyone tell you otherwise! :)

(Vinny wrote in another blog-thread, but moved here for obvious reasons!): if 90 % of people start experimenting with bretharianism/ living without food on liquids or without liquids and 50% become successful at it. Where would Sant-Mat go ?? On Mars or Venus.
Posted by: Vinny | July 30, 2020 at 07:52 AM

Hey Vinny, are you are aware Prahlad Jani passed away recently?: https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/city/ahmedabad/gujarat-ascetic-who-claimed-survival-without-food-and-water-passes-away-at-91/articleshow/76004475.cms

"withdraw their inner current to the 3rd eye" or whatever other somewhat bat shit crazy religious belief they may hold.

Posted by: manjit | July 29, 2020 at 07:14 AM

😅

I think the whole astral/causal travel thing is a bit bizarre and completely unnecessary. If anything, the practice is just going to make you even weirder. Meditation is good but no need to travel and “gain psychic powers”. That’s exactly what’s wrong with this world in the first place—everyone wants Power.

Power mad Presidents and Gurus trying to take over the world.

Oh, BTW, I was having some fun with numbers and discovered that FOX News is the mark of the beast. Yeah, for real...

😂

It’s a numerology thing.

1 — A J S
2 — B K T
3 — C L U
4 — D M V
5 — E N W
6 — F O X (666)
7 — G P Y
8 — H Q Z
9 — I R

😂

OMG, Manjit, what do you think of this?

https://www.quora.com/Is-it-easier-or-harder-for-psychopaths-to-become-psychics-mediums-or-paranormals/answer/Veronica-Moore-89?ch=10&share=efdacf82&srid=u8KPcg

I eagerly await your reply.

This is pretty profound—think of it, we’ve had 676,795 COVID related deaths globally over the past 6 months.

Compare that to the number of people who died from the Spanish flu in an 18 month period 100 years ago. Yes, over 50 Million people died from the Spanish flu in just 18 months. And there was a fraction of travel back then compared to today. Also, the population was roughly 1.7 Billion. Today we have over 7.8 Billion. There’s no comparison.

But the COVID situation could have turned out just like the Spanish flu and even worse If we weren’t taking the extreme measures that we are today with social distancing, face masks, lockdowns, closures, etc.

Just food for thought.

🙌 Face Masks 🙌 Social Distancing 🙌 Hand Sanitizer 🙌 STAY AT HOME 🙌

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