« RSSB guru and his family ordered to submit financial information | Main | Why you should be happy today, right now, no matter what »

November 25, 2019

Comments

Feed You can follow this conversation by subscribing to the comment feed for this post.


the quotes I used in my previous comment were taken from the book "Spiritual Gems", the letters written by Huzur Maharaj Baba Sawan Singh Ji (the Great Master) in response to the questions and queries of his American and European disciples and seekers.

I think G. Master's answers (and other mystics' as well) are tailored to
the individual questioner for their benefit and level of advancement
on the path. There are many anecdotes of contradictory responses to
the seemingly same question for instance.

There may even be exceptions to strict rules if conveyed by the inner
Master. So masters and advanced disciples may prescribe or even act
in anomalous ways at times. Of course, they bear full responsibility for
them too.

This is my sense after listening to online satsangs, particularly those of
Ishwar Puri.

We are sure God conveyed this to you.

Posted by: Gurus Inc | December 10, 2019 at 06:38 AM

No, it was Gurinder who told me. He said there isn’t a Kal—it’s just a concept.

Posted by: Sonia | December 10, 2019 at 04:50 PM

But then by your own accord GSD isn't even a Godman/Perfect Master. GSD ----> GOD 🤔🤔🤔. Come on how can you be so naive to believe a supposed fraudster (again as some think in here including yourself)???? LOL!!!

Now I wonder more than ever if you have ever been a RSSB satsangi because not talking about our inner spiritual experiences is one of the major rules in Sant Mat and even if you are an ex-satsangi you don't even seem to have that understanding.
Posted by: Jen | December 10, 2019 at 07:24 PM

Jen,

Just give it a skip. His Inner experience fakery has been established a while ago.

And God doesn’t appoint some wacky demigod to punish souls.

Makes sense. The "wacky demigod" is our own mind. What more
perfect form of torture is needed...

Posted by: Dungeness | December 10, 2019 at 08:28 PM

Right.

And mind is Kal's representative in each of us.

God doesn't punish or judge. Given the cosmic framework, he infact provides the escape key. Not his problem most don't use it.

Does Kal punish or simply adminster if he is just the bookkeeper as @777 said.

This goody 2-shoes Spence seems to have completely lost the plot. He seems to only abide by a guru or universe that abides by his own individual moral sense. He picks and chooses quotes out of place from teachers, people and court cases that support his own view.

Pretending to not have a huge ego is not the same as not having a huge ego. If the guru whacked some old lady in a wheelchair - maybe he could see something that the ‘wise’ Spence could not - in fact, my suspicion is that Spence is not v wise at all - so it’s hardly surprising he is so taken aback by the gurus action. Maybe she could actually run the 100m faster than Spence.

I also question just how goody 2-shoes anyone actually is, who is so hellbent on crucifying. What if the guru is innocent of all wrong-doings? Yep big trouble coming for this foolish man.

@arjuna - yep I see the big baby 👶 is maybe coming around a bit. Another scone?

@Dungeoness,

You wrote:
“I think G. Master's answers (and other mystics' as well) are tailored to
the individual questioner for their benefit and level of advancement
on the path. There are many anecdotes of contradictory responses to
the seemingly same question for instance.”

I think the answers are tailored but not necessarily for the benefit of the questioner.

Gurus Inc,

Why can’t you and Gurinder run off together with the money and just disappear? The day Gurinder is no longer RSSB Master will be the happiest day of my life... I certainly wouldn’t bother attending his funeral.

Gurus Inc,

Gurinder is what 68? That’s like 98 in guru years. Surely it’s time for him to move on. Do India and the world a favor.

No love lost.

The justice system ( covering eons ) is a level above our
7 Chakras Matrix.
The register is called "Akashic Records"

The beginning of correct analogue thinking is in the new QUBIT
a trillion ^x system
but the consequences are much higher
Hence the 'primitive' but TRUE Region system in RSSB
It can be approached by 'Intuition' what we all have.

When a Complete Master receives this intuitions , He does
not make the usual mistakes analysing
like psychic people do
( like they see the dead body in relation with a mill
after all police said it was a caffee milling grinder > a mill )

So, a Master is not all knowing but knows on a need to know
Then He sees the complete picture/history of the Soul before Him

Experienced satsangis have that also but don't use it unless ordered

Quantum mechanics make these correlations so much more clear

The lovely aqahabad sound makes everything possible
but we need only the intense LOVE. for that
After all The Shabad we hear is our so long neglected Soul

This Path is one of the best available in Creation

Be happy you came in contact with it
Without it your existence might be long , long, long
even many big bangs

I explained earlier in "This is how it works"
that God is just a Love accumulator for ever
and YOU Reader are HER

777

Please know when the SatGuru has to do with the High Court
his decisions are based on the akashic records
from before this Big Bang


Gurus Inc,

Why can’t you and Gurinder run off together with the money and just disappear? The day Gurinder is no longer RSSB Master will be the happiest day of my life... I certainly wouldn’t bother attending his funeral.

Posted by: Sonia | December 11, 2019 at 04:47 AM

Gurus Inc ...to hot too handle.

And yes whenever that day comes, you won't be missed for sure.

God is love ya..... Wonder who fills individuals with so much hate!!!!!

Gurus Inc,

Gurinder is what 68? That’s like 98 in guru years. Surely it’s time for him to move on. Do India and the world a favor.

No love lost.

Posted by: Sonia | December 11, 2019 at 04:58 AM

GSD is the master of his own death and he
grants no favours unfortunately.

Gurus Inc,

The day Gurinder is no longer RSSB Master will be the happiest day of my life... I certainly wouldn’t bother attending his funeral.

Posted by: Sonia | December 11, 2019 at 04:47 AM

Gurinder is what 68? That’s like 98 in guru years. Surely it’s time for him to move on. Do India and the world a favor.

Posted by: Sonia | December 11, 2019 at 04:58 AM

FROM THE ARCHIVES -

https://hinessight.blogs.com/church_of_the_churchless/2018/09/my-death-is-prematurely-celebrated.html

I believe U have the Package, . . pls Use it


777


BTW. somebody wrote Seth Shiv Dayal said
A few Sants go higher than the 5th region
Haha
It is no competition
Each Saint goes where His Heartt is and so go we!

Posted by: 💦 | December 10, 2019 at 01:02 PM

The best would be the package is taken away. But alas that's just wishful thinking. So the next best it's to be - the package remains unused.

Punishment certainly will be the order of the day. No escape from the consequences of certain utterances.

Also looking for Soamiji's utterance about only certain saints going beyond 5th region.


I think the answers are tailored but not necessarily for the benefit of the questioner.

@Suitsya

Oh thanks, that sews it up.


Shame poor Sonia the love / hate game has bitten her bad

Like it's done all the other exers that just love to hate the one who gave them a little (or a lot of) love to begin with.

Gurus Inc,

What you and your baba fail to understand is that you can’t buy love. GSD acts like the kind of guy who insults and beats his wife but thinks it’s ok as long as he buys her things. That’s a metaphor for how he treats the Sangat.

It’s not OK. Everyone who has any shred of sanity left in their mind would agree that it’s better to be loved and respected by a “poor” husband that beaten and ridiculed by a rich one.

And the good husband doesn’t have to be poor. He just has to care more about how he treats people than how much he owns.

Also looking for Soamiji's utterance about only certain saints going beyond 5th region.

me: Why ? 🤔

Your question makes me remember the christian standpoint
of sitting at the right side or at left of God
in Heaven
Isn't that primitive

777

Wow Sonia’s negativity is harrowing. We can only wish learn to be more human. Love thy neighbor....

Also looking for Soamiji's utterance about only certain saints going beyond 5th region.

me: Why ? 🤔

Your question makes me remember the christian standpoint
of sitting at the right side or at left of God
in Heaven
Isn't that primitive

777
Posted by: 🤔 | December 11, 2019 at 09:09 AM

@777 you question why are we interested. This simply to establish another fakery that Spence utters.

Ofcourse knowing it's not just primitive but profoundly stupid. But then at times it's necessary.

Anon,

Yes, harrowing indeed. But you aren’t me. Lucky for you. ALL of my neighbors and my worst “enemies” have treated me 100% better than GSD. So, I’m not apologizing.

Punishment certainly will be the order of the day. No escape from the consequences of certain utterances.

Also looking for Soamiji's utterance about only certain saints going beyond 5th region.

Posted by: Gurus Inc | December 11, 2019 at 06:26 AM

🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

😘

Good luck getting that “punishment” approved.

@Dungeness,

It’s hard to get mad at you because you’re so witty. 🙃

Gurus Inc,

And before you go getting your feelings all hurt, take a good look in the mirror.

Sonia yes I’m extremely thankful I’m not. Neighbor means everyone not just those who treat you the way you want. And I know your story fully remember. Anyways love and blessings to you.

It’s amazing how far a simple apology goes rather than a demand to be worshipped/adored/revered/feared.

There is no longer any fear left in my life. Just a dazed and confused bewilderment that one could so carelessly overlook everything (there were so many, many, many things) he’s done to hurt another without even a tinge of remorse. So, don’t be terribly surprised when I say I’m not sorry. The only thing I’m sorry about is being so ignorant as to believe it was a “path of love”. It has been proven otherwise. I don’t wish anyone to suffer as I did for the 14 years that I followed that path. But I will be happy when the day comes where it never crosses my mind. And that day could happen today. Just “poof” no memory.

Sonia you only need to apologize to yourself no one else. Good luck with that.

"Why can’t you and Gurinder run off together with the money and just disappear? The day Gurinder is no longer RSSB Master will be the happiest day of my life... I certainly wouldn’t bother attending his funeral." Posted by: Sonia

Sonia, the funniest side to your comments is that you haven't yet realised how committed you are to Gurinder. I know you are just having fun but it still seems like you have a very strong attachment to him albeit a very negative one. Obviously he has hurt your feelings (ego) but hatred for someone is also a strong commitment just as much as love. It can become an obsession.

Gurus Inc,

And before you go getting your feelings all hurt, take a good look in the mirror.

Posted by: Sonia | December 11, 2019 at 10:41 AM

We took a good hard look in the mirror. And guess what even the mirror confirmed we are the wisest of them all.

Thanks for the advice. 😄😄😄

Jen,

You are correct.

Jen interesting you say that. I believe all commenters on this site have some obsession with the Master. Some positive some negative but obsessed nonetheless. Even with all the comments on the financial scandal notice no one cares much about the Singh brothers all the focus is on the Master. Perhaps it’s time to change the name of this blog. 😉

We took a good hard look in the mirror. And guess what even the mirror confirmed we are the wisest of them all.

Thanks for the advice. 😄😄😄

Posted by: Gurus Inc | December 11, 2019 at 12:27 PM

I’m sure your mirror knows better than to argue with you.

—Snow White

Anon you say: "Jen interesting you say that. I believe all commenters on this site have some obsession with the Master".

Your comment has made me think about why I enjoy reading Church of the Churchless every day. It is a habit and also its news about Gurinder and the Dera, so I am still quite attached to Sant Mat in so many ways. Still following the vegetarian diet, no alcohol/drugs, moral life, etc. So, why do I think of myself as an ex-satsangi?

I'm not very good at meditating but I think of myself as living in awareness as much as possible. I do think that there is probably a lot of power in Simran and the Shabd because there are so many satsangis following Sant Mat now. Well, you've given me food for thought!

Hi Gurus Inc
You wrote
"Also looking for Soamiji's utterance about only certain saints going beyond 5th region."

It's right up front in the first chapter of Swami Ji's teachings, paragraph 3.

Sar Bachan prose, page 26, book 1 "The Teachings of Radha Soami, translated from the Hindi by Sardar Seva Singh".

"3. All the Teachers, Sages, Incarnations (Avatars) or Prophets from the past, in every religion, started towards the real abode within themselves by means of spiritual practices, but all of them did not reach the final stage. A good many of them stopped at the first stage, and a few Sadhs and devotees reached the third stage. Saints alone reached the fifth stage, Sat Nam, and only a few of them reached the eighth stage., Radha Soami Dham. "

Not all Saints reach the highest stage, only a few of them.

This is flat out false. All of them either either reached the Lord or are on their way. Your love is doing your part. He does the rest.

Sonia Sonia it's OK don't worry be happy

We all know once bitten twice shy
Nobody forced anyone to take that awful bite of the apple, but bite we did.

Like the deep sea marlin that took the deep sea fisherman's bait, once bitten the hook sits firmly in its nose between his eyes. He can dive to the bottom of the ocean or soar above the waves, he can drag the fisherman's boat out into the ocean but the fisherman lets him run for fear of breaking the line. All along the hook sits firmly in his nose.

Once tired out the marlin realizes that how much he tried to free his nose from the hook its stuck, and to alleviate the tugging pain that throbs between his eyes, it's better relief to swim towards the boat than away from it. Achtung baby.

As we say in the classics, moenie worry nie, alles sal regkom.

Jen you say
So, why do I think of myself as an ex-satsangi?

That’s just a name isn’t it? None of us are satsangis. We are seekers and some are not even that.
Once a Satsangi in a true sense you can never be an ex. So all this “branding” is trivial.

Whodunit,

Afrikaans? :) You reminded me of the strangest thing that happened to me my first trip to the Dera (there were many strange things but this was the strangest). I went for a walk and stopped in front of the old Satsangar. I stood there for the longest time because there was the gentlest breeze blowing towards me. Then after some time a man came out of the building and offered me an apple. I wanted to ask him somethings but he didn’t say a word and just walked off. I couldn’t make this up if I tried...

Then I took the apple back to my room and remembering the Grim Brothers’ comment Gurinder during the evening meeting the day before, I decided not to eat it. My Satsangi friends said they were sure nothing was wrong with it but I kept it on my nightstand and didn’t eat it.

Never a stranger place...

I don’t know if you’ve seen the TV series ‘Once’ (Once upon a Time) but the Dera makes the little town in ‘Once’ seem normal.

Once...
https://youtu.be/29217uc7fOo

Hi Whodonit
"he can drag the fisherman's boat out into the ocean but the fisherman lets him run for fear of breaking the line."

Not quite. There is no fear from the fisherman. He is enjoying himself. The fisherman fears nothing.

The Marlin carries the fear, and in a dream she is flying away, always away from the boat that is death, but all a dream within herself, and always back to herself.

The beautiful ocean, the clear blue sky, the moon and the stars at night she sees, leaping up, emerging momentarily from the deep sleep of the sea.

She runs away on fear from what is actually herself.

She leaps to join a distant sky she can never touch, but which is completely within herself. She is the sky, but does not know it yet. Even the fisherman is just a character in the Marlin's dream. And she is also the boat and the fisherman, her own inevitable death from this dream. She fears the death of the dream most of all, but little understands her own fear.

Wake up, wake up beloved.


She fears the death of the dream most of all, but little understands her own fear.
Wake up, wake up beloved.

A fish story. The most moving one of all.

I’m sure your mirror knows better than to argue with you.

—Snow White

Posted by: Sonia | December 11, 2019 at 03:16 PM

The only thing thing the mirror knows is it reflects human beings in all its reality. Its reflection is neither distorted or twisted. It has no personal likes or dislikes, no preconceptions, no biases and gives an exact image of what comes before it. It is not affected by any feelings of love or hatred.

What would the mirror tell you Sonya?


It's an allegory story Spence
Once told to me by a good friend from Hawaii.

It's simply allegorical and pretty apt.
Nothing to do with fear by the fisherman. The fisherman is in control. This is the archetype story of how the deep sea fisherman catches his fish.

The fisherman rows his little boat out in the ocean and drops his line lowering the bait in the water and sits and waits.
Eventually the marlin comes along and takes the bait.
Nobody forced the marlin to take it but take it he did. Either out of curiosity or out of hunger, nevertheless the bait was taken and the marlin was hooked, embedded firmly in his nose between his eyes.
The marlin thrashes and dives, soars and switches swimming furiously dragging the fisherman and his boat out into the deep ocean.
The fisherman lets him run for days knowing that if he reels him in too early he could have too much strain on the line the line could snap under tension.
He let's the marlin run and thrash until it's tired and the pain in his nose becomes unbearable.

Eventually the marlins resistance wanes and worn-out he rather chooses to swim toward the boat and accept his fate to alleviate the nagging throb of the painful tugging by the hook buried deep in his nose.


Hi Whodunit
You write
"It's an allegory story Spence
Once told to me by a good friend from Hawaii."

Yes, it's The Old Man and the Sea by Hemingway.

"He is a great fish and I must convince him, he thought. I must never let him learn his strength nor what he could do if he made his run. If I were him I would put in everything now and go until something broke. But, thank God, they are not as intelligent as we who kill them; although they are more noble and more able. "

But I prefer my own allegory.

My heart goes to the fish, and not the fisherman who harpoons them.


The lost son in the bible
The lost son found among the robbers
The worm and the golden apple
This marlin story
the sheep and shepherd

Interesting to ponder over the different story lines and the interplay of characters in each of the stories.

It seems that only in the lost son story of the bible the characters are on the same level, does the son goes home on his own accord and rejoyces his father in seeing him again.

In the other stories, the characters are on a different level and in one way or another forced to follow.

Grandmother, you told me as a kid not to sell my soul to the devil …… I never understood, it created unknown fear ...what is a soul and what a devil and what selling.

Better not to accept or look for apples offered by strangers so you become awate of things you shouldn't

Whodunit writes,......” Eventually the marlins resistance wanes and worn-out he rather chooses to swim toward the boat and accept his fate to alleviate the nagging throb of the painful tugging by the hook buried deep in his nose.”

Me: Actually , I love your allegory of how we Charan Initiates got hooked, and are still hooked to his fish line, that he uses his “ Bulldozer Chain” for fishing line! Regardless of what Bait was used on the Bulldozer Fishing Line, we Charan Initiates are still here, floundering around, trying to get the Hook out of our Third Eye, and delete his Clone he projected there at our individual Initiations, but no matter how Exer some of might sound, we might as well just quit trying to escape, because that Fishing Line Chain is not going to release us until Charan Singh personally unhooks us when he releases us to Sach Khand!
For me, the Bait he used to snag me, was Julian Johnson’s “ Path of The Master” Book. Once snagged, and the Hook of Shabd was paralyzing my Third Eye, I had no other choice except to continue to “ Die While Living” another day.
Jim S.

But the poor unsuspecting marlin. All it wanted was a little grub, now the poor buggers got a gdam hook in the nose.

Jim and a few others in here,

I do hope you realise it's your Master, Hazur Charan Singh's birthday today.

The Old Man and the Sea. Verily, verily, I say unto you, Hemingway is rolling in his grave.

Yip Huzur Malik Maharaj Charan Singh Ji's birthday today born December 12th 1916.

https://pin.it/wytrlg3afoas5u

Jim S 🙏
Yippee bulldozer do as bulldozer does, marlin do as it can (to get free).

It simply is as it is,
Which marlin reckons they had anything to do with the hook or the fishing line or the fisherman's bait ?

Hi Um:

You wrote:
"It seems that only in the lost son story of the bible the characters are on the same level, does the son goes home on his own accord and rejoices his father in seeing him again."

There are two stories of return and reunion in the New Testament Bible. One is direct, the other implied: The Prodigal Son, and the hidden treasure:

The Hidden Treasure
"Again, the Kingdom of Heaven is like a treasure hidden in the field, which a man found, and hid. In his joy, he goes and sells all that he has, and buys that field."
Matthew 13:44

Why did the man hide the treasure in the field? Was that honest? Should he have told the owner of the field? Was it fair to the owner to keep him or her ignorant of the treasure?

The man who found the treasure and hid it again appears to have bought the field at a price agreed to by the owner under the pretense that the field contained no treasure. By giving this illustration as a positive example, is Jesus promoting questionable behavior?

Why did the man choose to deceive the owner? Perhaps the man knew that even by selling all he had, he would not be able to afford the true price of the treasure. No one can. Why did he have to have it? As for the owner, who was he? Perhaps the owner was not deceived at all.

Consider what may have been lost through the oral tradition in this rendition of Jesus’ parable of the prodigal son.

Perhaps the original went a little something like this:

The kingdom of heaven is like treasure hidden in a man’s own fields.
The man had been away for so long he didn’t recognize his own home.
Something inside the man brought him to this field and to the family treasure, his birthright, which the man, as a boy, had helped His father bury long ago.

As soon as he uncovered the treasure he knew it was his, but did not understand why. So he hid it again, and then in his joy went and sold all he had and bought that field from his father, whom he also didn’t recognize.

His father was so happy to see his son’s return that he played along and sold him the field for trinkets. His father knew that his son was gradually remembering.

One day his son realized that the field, the treasure and the father were all his to begin with.

The son ran through the fields up to the house he hadn’t seen in years. Now everything was clear, everything familiar. He ran into that house, his home, and embraced his father. All that mattered to his father was that day of reunion.

This is what the kingdom of heaven is like.

Jesus’ parable also has another, even simpler allegorical explanation. The man found this treasure in the field within himself. He gladly paid his debts to those around him, finished his duties, left his old life, and made his home that field, and the treasure the center of his new life.

The only thing thing the mirror knows is it reflects human beings in all its reality. Its reflection is neither distorted or twisted. It has no personal likes or dislikes, no preconceptions, no biases and gives an exact image of what comes before it. It is not affected by any feelings of love or hatred.

What would the mirror tell you Sonya?


Posted by: A Wise 🦉 | December 11, 2019 at 11:35 PM

Love yourself

@ sonia

But you do love yourself . You sound like you need to tackle your own issues here on earth rather than having so much venom towards GSD.

You do seem full of yourself in many ways like spence. Sometimes just let things be. I have seen stuff in my life in the forces that would help you stop feeling so angry. Because you realise that sometimes you have to let things be.

A wise 🦉, A Smart One, Gurus Inc, and so on...

At least I use my real name and I don’t pretend to be special. If it’s a sin—I e commuted it (with a few exceptions) and honestly, I don’t care. You can judge me all you want. I assure you you are more pious than me. But pious has never been on my checklist. Obnoxious, sure... not wise, or smart or guru. Life’s too short to be boring.

On another trivial note, I’m grocery shopping for my dad. I haven’t been grocery shopping in years. This is hell. I don’t cook either... perhaps my mirror would tell me I’m undomesticated. 😂

Hi Arjuna:
You wrote:
"You do seem full of yourself in many ways like spence. Sometimes just let things be. I have seen stuff in my life in the forces that would help you stop feeling so angry. Because you realise that sometimes you have to let things be."

So long as you must stand upon the criticism of any other person, the foundation is flawed. And no, obviously, you haven't just let go, and let be. You said earlier that you had changed your mind about Gurinder. But does that mean you do not accept Sonia's right to her own perspective?

Do you presume to know better than her?

Then you accuse me of the same criticism?


Leave me out of your comments, if you can. And if you can't, then that's telling you something.

Remember, I'm only words on an electronic page. If those words stir feeling in you, it is not worth making personal attacks on any person. But it may be a good opportunity to question your own reaction.

I say that you were right to criticize Gurinder. And I say you are right to honor him also.

Both are true, and no one can say, at this level, which is superior or inferior.

Because what you honor may have been, or may still be, superstitions that even the Saint wants you to jettison.

A saint may drag you, but Arjuna, you are still being dragged, as is Um, Guru Inc, Anon and others.

And Brian Ji is in the bulldozer driver seat, by Maharaji and Gurinder's appointment.

And he is dragging us all, myself included, through our layers of illusion. By Appointment of Radha Soami!


@Arjuna,

I have seen things that would make a saint tremble with fear. And I don’t feel sorry for myself. I’m perfectly comfortable with saying I’m imperfect in every way. And I mean EVERY possible way. And yet my family still loves me... A LOT. Maybe there’s something wrong with them too. 😂 And most definitely I am blessed to have that.

Is that pious of me?

If I’m angers at Gurinder, then quite honestly, he is the only person who has the right to be offended by it. But I can assure you it doesn’t phase him in the least.

That said, I know you’ve seen many horrors yourself... life is like one big Brothers Grimm Fairy Tale.

Or maybe I am full of myself. Sure, I’ll add that to my list of character defects. No prob. Thanks for the enlightenment.

Posted by: Spence Tepper | December 12, 2019 at 10:22 AM

That sounds completely reasonable to me. :)

@ Sonia

Nice response sister . I liked that.

All the best

Vijay

Wtf is everyone so angry at the guru for?

I never understood why the posse on this here website got their pitch forks out in the 1st place.

What has GSD actually done to any of you to cause such personal offense and a heinous crime?

I get the feeling there too many molly-coddled touchy-feely selfish types who kind of expect the guru to save them or give them personal attention or something. Get over yourselves - the guy is a guide, he can’t snap his fingers and make all your problems disappear. In fact, seems likes fished out the kind of tough love which is just what the doctor ordered to snap a few outa their ‘woe is me’ funk.

I got no such illusions - to me the most he is a spiritual guide - you got to use your own common sense.

If you disagree with him, or figure he’s a fake, move on - end of story, nobody in rssb forced you to join or tried to stop you leaving - the vitriol and propaganda I’ve never understood.

It’s almost like you angry cos the guru didn’t kiss you night-night and tuck you in beddy-by don’t let the bed bugs bite.

I mean come on.

Let the magnificent 7 ride again

@ spence

I ain't got nothing against you but cant stand people who are writing their chapter and verse in condemning a full master.

The bulldozer analogy you use is bullshit that bulldozer is forging your bars mate.

Keep that new age bible shit to yourself. Sorry mate you asked do I presume to know someone . Yes son I usually do!!!!! I will judge as you have done all your life ain't!!!

See you pissed me off right off lately boy

A wise 🦉,

This may surprise you...
https://www.truemirror.com/

Another tale told on music: Babul Mora - Journey to the Infinite
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j3VvhvBUSak

Thank you SP, for the reminder of Charan's birthdate.

Today is Friday 13th in the land of Oz. Huge storm last night.

Found this quote:
"Ques:" Why would the soul want to come back here from the superior planes, knowing how much suffering and misery is here?"

Charan: Ans: "Even now, we do not want to go back. We see suffering all around us. If anyone tells you to prepare yourself, you are going to die, are you prepared to die at once? We say, "No, we have so many things to do yet." So even now we are not prepared to leave in spite of all the suffering in this world. We may think we are prepared to die, but realize that we are not when faced with the situation. Knowing that we are weeping and suffering, knowing that we are so miserable and unhappy, still we are not doing any­thing to get rid of this condition. We are doing the same things again and again. We are not taking lessons from that deed we have done in the past birth for which we are suffering now. We are victims of the senses, just the same as we used to be. We are not taking any lessons from the past. Nobody does.When the situation arises we do the same thing, and we are again sorry. We have forgotten the reason why we are unhappy."

Um,

Beautiful. Is she really Indian?

@whodunit

Clearly I have a lot of time on my hands today...

Is your real name Chris?

Georgy you said
“It’s almost like you angry cos the guru didn’t kiss you night-night and tuck you in beddy-by don’t let the bed bugs bite.”

Haha so true. Or in Sonia’s case he didn’t tell her what she wanted to hear. Instead he told her to stop feeling sorry for herself or something like that.
Imagine if telling someone to stop feeling sorry for yourself can invoke such negativity makes me think how many times I told that to some of my relatives or friends.

This blog is entertainment nothing more it’s actually quite hilarious from time to time.
Oh hey that’s what Babaji said. You want entertainment go to Brian Hines blog 😂

@ Sonja

If you mean the lady danser, she must be although she doesn't make that agile impression we are used from classic Indian dansers.
https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=Keka+Sinha+

The lady singer certainly is … and famous too
https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=Dhanashre+pandit+rai
If there is you want to learn on Indian music and singing … she is the teacher.

It was certainly beautiful … listening all of a sudden I was flooded with tears as I often did when I was actively involved in the path … I had almost forgotten. It would happen anywhere and any time. The only problem I had in those days when it would hit me during driving.

Funny these memories … like memories of an happy childhood.

Georgy Porgy,

You take obnoxious to a whole new level. And who needs special attention from the guru when we have people like you constantly weighing in?? Trust me, I get all the attention I need. If I wanted his attention I would be nice to him and tell him how “amazing and wonderful” he is like all the people in his inner circle do. Pleeeeez.

Hi Arjuna
You write
"I ain't got nothing against you but cant stand people who are writing their chapter and verse in condemning a full master.

" The bulldozer analogy you use is bullshit that bulldozer is forging your bars mate.

"Keep that new age bible shit to yourself. Sorry mate you asked do I presume to know someone . Yes son I usually do!!!!! I will judge as you have done all your life ain't!!!

" See you pissed me off right off lately boy. "

Actually Arjuna, it does appear that you do have something against me. But you have never met me so I know it's nothing.

I've written so much about Gurinder, and my position changes with the available information. Though in all circumstances I advocate honesty, compassion and helpfulness.

Oddly, it seems most of that flies over your head. As if Compassion is above your pay grade. And so you respond with hatred. Or else it is the very compassion and forgiveness that rubs you the wrong way. I don't know. The jury is still out.

Let's see where you are tomorrow. Or ten minutes from now.

When you and I started our dialogue you told a story of being all alone and treated harshly by Gurinder. So you rejected him. At that time I was a "Gurinder can do no wrong" Satsangi and was trying to convince you to give things time.

But I never was harsh with you, as you are with me. And I'm never harsh with Baba Ji. Stuff happened, fraud happened. And his bank accounts were the washer and dryer of the money laundering. He gave other people access to those accounts, and made a lot of verbal agreements, and he's been a bit of a stonewall when it comes to commmunication, except to deny that he accepted any money, even when hundreds of millions poured through his accounts, and his wife's and sons. Bu it's still a mystery. Don't you think I'm being generous calling it a mystery?

The condemnation is all yours, Arjuna. You were condemning Gurinder then. Now you are condemning me. But if you are going to condemn me, can you also practice the forgiveness I've spoken of?

Try forgiveness. If Gurinder is perfect you don't need to forgive him. But you still need to learn forgiveness for everyone else. Especially those you don't agree with. So you don't forge more bars, and basically, can live with yourself in peace.

And if Gurinder is wrong, you still need to learn forgiveness. Then he's just another Bloke-In-A-Rolls like so many who have come and gone, making lots of changes, lots of pretty new buildings, but leaving the earth and a few people a bit scorched. And generally worse for it.

But these blokes are just as much a victim as anyone else and deserve our pity, and our offer to help. Sadly that can't begin until the day when judgment is made. So the minimum condition for compassion and kindness is honesty. We can all be honest. You can start by acknowledging we, including you, don't know the actual truth about the Fraud and Gurinder's involvement. I don't know. You don't know. He could be innocent. He could be guilty.

That's the foundation for compassion and forgiveness, and mercy : honesty and truth.

In both cases we should all forgive and offer our help. Because we are all part of the same family. We are all damaged goods.

Forgiveness isn't just for the perfect, rich and powerful. It is also for the poor, weak and foolish. They especially need it.

The only price tag is honesty. Keep all the doors to compassion open. It makes it easier to be honest. Saints come through there.

Hi Georgy
You wrote
"What has GSD actually done to any of you to cause such personal offense and a heinous crime?"

Get real. There is a series of criminal frauds totaling hundreds of millions of dollars of other people's money siphoned through the bank accounts of Baba Ji, his wife and sons, and all the participants were RSSB leaders, genius and friends of Baba Ji. Many of these have been dearly loved and trusted by Statsangis.

That anger, suspicion, and distrust are understandable. Of course no one has the full picture. But it doesn't look good.

Who actually did what is still a mystery. And Baba Ji is being as transparent as mud.

Now, he could still be innocent. We don't really know what happened.

But anyone who was determined and dedicated at least to their spiritual practice on the grounds that the Master was living evidence of it is, tonight, somewhere on the scale of patiently waiting, shocked, angry, disappointed. But no one who is honest is in denial about the fact that a series of crimes has been committed and the final word on who took what is still unknown. We only know hundreds of millions of stolen funds went through Baba Ji's accounts. And we don't know, actually, where they ended up.


All we know is a group of RSSB leaders, many in Baba Ji's family, and Baba Ji as well, had some connection to all this. It came through them.

That's a fact. But who did what? To whom? Who knows.

I'm not telling you anything you don't already know.

All that aside, we should be patient with each other at this time.

We're members of the same family. We all bought the same car.

My friend who lives at the Dera said yesterday that GSD still has to go to court—which we already know. Just not sure when his next court date is. She said everyone at the Dera believes these are all rumors.

But Spence is right—we have many facts along with several unanswered questions. We will have to be patient and see what unfolds.

Sonia interesting that you say you don’t want any attention from the master and yet a few months ago this is what you posted when he told you to stop feeling sorry for yourself.
From your post a few months ago
“However, even then I was very much in awe of him and somewhat "in-love" in a Master/disciple kind of way. I thought he would be the last person on earth that would ever hurt me.
My heart was absolutely broken”

Wake up sister your in denial. You want the attention and you didn’t get what you wanted and now your bitter.

SP writes,....... “Jim and a few others in here,

I do hope you realise it's your Master, Hazur Charan Singh's birthday today.

Posted by: SP | December 12, 2019 at 05:38 AM”

Me: I posted here in the past how I had purchased a Term $100,000 Life Policy from an Internet Insurance Agency. When I received my hard copy Policy in the mail, my heart skipped a few beats when Zi saw the Signature on my Policy Was signed,........Charan Singh, Agent! So, all of this time I have been insured both Spiritually, and Physically, by none other than by Charan Singh. But on his Birthday, In my Snail Mail today, I received a letter from my Insurance Co. that my Police expires Dec. 19, this month! Damn, two reminders from Charan the same day. I wonder if my Graduation Day is near? Quite Amazing, actually,
Jim S.

Maybe when the Tin Man finally gets to see the Wizard he can ask for a heart.

Posted by: Sonia | December 10, 2019 at 07:46 PM

This Tin Man is smart. He knows how lucky he is not to have one.

Today is Charan Singh’s birthday? And a full moon. It’s been a very strange day. And yes, I’ve had an inordinate amount of free time on my hands. It feels like time is standing still. Sorry for posting so many comments but it truly feels like the clock has stopped (maybe I’m going to die soon 🤔).

Anyway, my husband and I took a drive tonight and for the first time since leaving India last December did we talk about his experiences at the Dera. It was the first time since we returned that I was willing to talk about it without screaming (a slight exaggeration).

He shared something with me that shook me. It shook me because his experience was the exact opposite of mine. He said that while he was sitting in front of GSD during karaoke (I didn’t go to that) Gurinder locked eyes with him a dozen times and gave him “darshan” in such a way that if Andrew had to die “right now today to get that feeling again, I would do it in a heartbeat”.

My husband was very kind and supportive of me throughout my difficult experience there. He didn’t share this with me before because obviously I wasn’t in the mood to talk about his cult.

All I can say is how strange it is that humans can be in the same place and have completely opposite experiences. I felt nothing but depression and fear and he felt some some sort of mystic love.

I don’t even know why I’m sharing this. It almost pisses me off even more.

I almost think he was nice to my husband just to spite me.
Lol 😂 😄 🤨 😠


It’s official, I no longer believe in God. This is all bullshit.


...he's been a bit of a stonewall when it comes to commmunication, except to deny that he accepted any money, even when hundreds of millions poured through his accounts, and his wife's and sons.

Actually, wasn't GSD's first comment he "hadn't accepted money"?
But then, at a later date, he issued a clarifying statement that he
"doesn't owe anyone". That's quite different.

The Dhillon family civil liability does not establish who within the family
and/or associates participated in civil and/or criminal malfeasance,
only that they're on the hook for illicit loans. So, until more facts are
uncovered in litigation, GSD may legitimately allege he "doesn't owe
anyone" and had no knowledge of the illegality.

His brief statement, perhaps per on attorney's advice, was likely
intentionally brief and given only to assure RSSB audiences that
morally he is innocent. The strict brevity avoids client missteps in
weighing in on areas under litigation.

Sonia

Don’t think you need to be nice to him or fawn over him - I think that’s exactly what he seeks to avoid. Just be yourself and get yourself right.

When I went to Haynes Park, I got the distinct impression he hated the repeated requests for ‘grace’. But he just took part in sort of light-hearted to and fro with the crowd, many of whom obviously adored him.

Maybe others are correct to put him up on this pedestal but to me he is just a man. If he speaks sense, and touches something inside of you, then I say listen to him and his path. Like a v wise uncle or aunty. If not, then go elsewhere.

But what you so pissed off at the poor guy for?

Brother Spence - that must be your 1000th sermon on the mount. I think it’s you that needs to get real. What is it then - are we all brothers or you trying to get you brother Gurinder convicted or what. What kind of a bro are you ? Holy moly who needs enemies with a bro like you.

@ Sonya,

Your words about the difference between you and your husband reminds me of the story of Laila an Jamun, where Jamun ends up saying smilingly: "Friends, you should see her through my eyes".

That story is not at all about Laila [GSD], not for a moment … or whether she deserves love, respect etc or not, is attractive or not etc …. no, its is all about the characters of the beholders, their points of view, about how each of them se the world

It is pointing at … where …. answers are to be found.

If you would leave GSD and everything related to him alone for a while and concentrate on researching the feelings, motivations and thoughts towards him from yourself and your husband i guess you will be supprised about the outcome.

Own your own thoughts and feelings … and …. if you I will help and do you good.

PS
>>…. if you I will help and do you good.<<

should read:
if you do, it will help and do you good.

sometime this PC forgets to enter letters, there is no spelling controll and the writer too rambless here and there like an old car

Um,
Thanks for the beautiful link...
Really beautiful
<3

Hi Georgy
You asked
"Brother Spence - that must be your 1000th sermon on the mount. I think it’s you that needs to get real. What is it then - are we all brothers or you trying to get you brother Gurinder convicted or what. What kind of a bro are you ? Holy moly who needs enemies with a bro like you."

If we are brothers then naturally we want to help each other. That starts with honesty.

Now you've gotten sermon 1,001. Baba Ji says your magic number is 1,111, so I'm resigned to my work for a little while. But happily so.

Dear Georgy Porgy,

I don't mean to influence but only offer the insider's view.

Please google "the path of the masters - The Baha'i Studies Web Server" and click for the pdf. It's a 1980 edition of Julian P. Johnson's classic.

"4. THE MASTER AND THE SUPREME ONE
There is one quality of the Great Masters which I hesitate to write down here because it is so difficult to avoid misunderstanding on this subject, yet it must be written. It is a fact that there is no difference between the real Saint or Master and the Supreme Being himself." (pp. 213-214)

I woke up today in my rational mind (it’s been many years). What I now know using the Powers’s of logic (something we should all practice a little more) is that all so called “spiritual experiences” are delusions of the mind. Gurinder is just a lonely old man playing a sad game. I can feel nothing but pity for him. He is pitiful.

The closest thing we have to “saints” in this world are people like Brian who care about the truth, logic and rational thinking.

@Anon,

You see, I am also “Sarah”. Why don’t you go back to August 2018 and read all of those posts.

Gurinder saw all of those things that I wrote about him and was humiliated, hurt and angry. He is only human. So, he took the opportunity last December to get back at me. I’m sure in his mind that was “just do karma”. Fair is fair. When I think about it honestly, I can understand why he did what he did. He’s just a man, his feelings were hurt and his ego attacked. He’s not unlike me or you.

And that is the rest of the story.

The End.

Yes, the line just snapped... the cord is broken.

Amami

Yes maybe others have made such a recognition - I have not. I’m not sure that I am v spiritually inclined, or if I was, my upbringing and education have been covered by my spiritual antenna.

For example, I certainly have never seen orbs of light like our godfearing and holy Brother Spence.

But there is something about our existence that no words or science or anything else comes remotely close to explaining. Every now and again it is touched upon fleetingly in comments from various commentators on this site - mostly satsangis of a more genuine spiritual bent.

Even Hinesey Ji used to write far more poignant articles about 5-10 years ago. Nowadays I am less interested to hear about superficial ‘clever-by-half’ neuroscience or the health of his pooch PuPu or to see him moving around slowly in his PJs - but a couple of years ago there were some spiritual gems. Seems it’s all pseudoscience now.

"It is a fact that there is no difference between the real Saint or Master and the Supreme Being himself." (pp. 213-214)

And he knows this.. How?

"It is a fact."

Today we are more careful using that sort of language.

The Supreme being..... That would be everything, including you and I.

What Supreme being is separate from any part of the creation?

Georgy Porgy,

So what is genuine spirituality? Not as Julian Johnson explains? How does Baba Ji fit into your understanding?

Spence Tepper and Sonia / Sonya / Bella rose / Sarah, get real. Getalife or Getafix.

"Gurinder saw all of those things that I wrote about him and was humiliated, hurt and angry."

Sonia/Sarah you do have a very high opinion of yourself and a sense of importance. Probably because you are used to being part of the "in crowd" at Dera but honestly, get over it girl. You are just another bumbling ex-satsangi but still constantly stroking your ego by commenting here. Of course much of your gossip keeps this blog going but I really don't think Gurinder would care about your poor little girl hurt feelings.

The reason why Gurinder chastised you is probably trying to knock down your pride and ego and bring you back to earth. No-one is special, we are all little nothings, including Gurinder.

Jen, Guru Inc, and Whodonit, if you could find a way to share your thoughts without tearing others down (all in the name of defending the Master) I think it would be preferable to Gurinder Himself. After all, aren't you doing what you are accusing Sonia of doing?

But don't listen to me. Just try to emulate the more advanced of your brothers and sisters who love the Master and are reasonable with opposing opinions. Um, Brian Ji, Manjit, Dungeness and Mediator have different views, but they all present them with great honor, that speaks will of their positions.

Jen, you've done this also, before, in sharing your Zen wisdom. What are the conditions for you to speak to your own power and mastery of Zen thought?

Maharaji asked "who actually believes they are wrong? What purpose does that serve to bring it up?"

Personally, I think Sonia hits the target with stunning accuracy.


Gurinder is just a lonely old man playing a sad game. I can feel nothing but pity for him. He is pitiful.

"Verily", sayeth the sermonizer, "Be one with your pity. Embrace this sad
piteous game atop our forsaken CofC Mount. Thy pity overfloweth.
Surely tears and mercy will wash away these infidels of the heart.

Loneliness hath left thee now. We've vanquished the sad, lonely man.
He is us, we are Him. His pity is ours and ours his. It floweth away. We soar
arm in arm to CofC regions of light. Beyond pity now and forever. Amen."

Georgy Porgy has hit the nail on the head. Brian used to write some excellent stuff back in the day. Nowadays it’s mindless mindfulness.
I bought one of these new age dudes books, spirituality without religion, it made no sense at all. I kept reading, thinking he’d make some great point. Alas, ‘twas not to be.
Some of the comments here are amusing, more than interesting or enlightening.
I really liked the magnificent seven stuff.
Ahhhh sigh 😔

Sonia I know you are Sarah no need to tell me. I knew your comments about your Dera visit when you were commenting as Sonya too. I hope someday you find the peace you so desperately seek. Semis like your husband has. Lucky him

Ah yes
The Magnificent Seven
On a sizzling hot
Scorching sunny summer’s day
Seven mighty security sevadars
put the insolent puppy in his place. Teaching him Honesty and Humility the RSSB UK way.
Oh my, those were the days

Tea and scones all round

Jen you are incredibly judgmental.

Dungeoness—you are amazingly self-righteous.

Whodunit—getafix? Is that your saintly advice? Well done. 👏 You know who I am and I know who you are so GFY.

Verify your Comment

Previewing your Comment

This is only a preview. Your comment has not yet been posted.

Working...
Your comment could not be posted. Error type:
Your comment has been saved. Comments are moderated and will not appear until approved by the author. Post another comment

The letters and numbers you entered did not match the image. Please try again.

As a final step before posting your comment, enter the letters and numbers you see in the image below. This prevents automated programs from posting comments.

Having trouble reading this image? View an alternate.

Working...

Post a comment

Comments are moderated, and will not appear until the author has approved them.

Your Information

(Name is required. Email address will not be displayed with the comment.)

Welcome


  • Welcome to the Church of the Churchless. If this is your first visit, click on "About this site--start here" in the Categories section below.
  • HinesSight
    Visit my other weblog, HinesSight, for a broader view of what's happening in the world of your Church unpastor, his wife, and dog.
  • BrianHines.com
    Take a look at my web site, which contains information about a subject of great interest to me: me.
  • Twitter with me
    Join Twitter and follow my tweets about whatever.
  • I Hate Church of the Churchless
    Can't stand this blog? Believe the guy behind it is an idiot? Rant away on our anti-site.