RSSB guru ordered to appear before Delhi High Court on Nov. 14

UPDATE: A commenter shared a link to another story by Business Today on this subject that contains more information. There's a Delhi High Court order for all those involved in the financial fraud investigation to appear on November 14.

Daiichi case: Delhi HC orders RSSB chief Dhillon & family, Singh brothers, Ghodhwanis to be present in court on November 14

BusinessToday.In on March 12 reported Singh brothers could only pay the $500 million order against them to compensate Daiichi, provided the money owed to them by RSSB chief Gurinder Singh Dhillon and his family is recovered

BusinessToday.In

Delhi High Court has asked RSSB chief Gurinder Singh Dhillon and his family members, former Religare promoters Shivinder Singh and Malvinder Singh, former Religare chief Sunil Godhwani and his brother Sanjay Godhwani to be present at the court hearing in the Daiichi Sankyo case on November 14. The court has asked all accused to remain present in the court, along with all the documents relating to the dealings. "The garnishees shall also remain present in the Court on the next date of hearing along with all the documents relating to the dealings/transactions with the judgment debtors as well as their related companies on the next date of hearing," says the court order dated October 11.

Daiichi had earlier enforced an arbitration order in Singapore that ordered the brothers to pay Daiichi $500 million towards alleged non-disclosure of crucial information during the sale of Ranbaxy Laboratories to Daiichi in 2008.

Also read: Recover money from RSSB chief Dhillon & family to pay Singh brothers' dues to Daiichi: Delhi HC

Expanding the scope of people from whom the money could be recovered, the court in June had named 56 entities, including Dhillon, his wife Shabnam Dhillon and other family members, and Godhwanis.

BusinessToday.In had reported on March 12 that Singh brothers can only pay the $500 million order against them to compensate Daiichi, provided the money owed to them by RSSB chief Gurinder Singh Dhillon and his family is recovered. In his submission, Malvinder has maintained that he can pay Daiichi provided he recovered the money owed to him.

Also read: SC take note! Singh brothers can pay off $500 million to Daiichi, provided the money is recovered

Besides the Dhillon family, the Delhi HC had also issued 'garnishee orders' -- an order that's issued against a third party to recover money to settle a debt or dues -- against several Dhillon and RSSB associates' companies, including Prius Real Estate, Addon Realty, Payne Realtors SGGD Projects, Luminous Holding.

BusinessToday.In had earlier reported the flow of money from Singh brothers to entities owned and controlled by Gurinder Singh Dhillon, his family and RSSB associates. RoC filings and terms sheets say between 2011 and 2014, Rs 1,107.5 crore from the Rs 9,576 crore sale proceeds of Ranbaxy to Daiichi Sankyo was paid through various RHC group firms. Thereafter, this money was transferred to Prius Real Estate Private Limited controlled by Dhillon family associates and RSSB functionaries through optionally convertible debentures (OCD).

Today The Economic Times of India ran this story concerning the guru of Radha Soami Satsang Beas, Gurinder Singh Dhillon.
Download Daiichi Sankyo-Ranbaxy case: HC asks Radha Soami head 54 others to deposit Rs 6 000 crore

It doesn't appear to be good news for Dhillon and his family, who reportedly were the beneficiaries of hundreds of millions of dollars fraudulently siphoned from RHC Holding, a public company.

Delhi HC orders RSSB chief Gurinder Singh Dhillon to appear in court on Nov 14

The RSSB chief is among 55 individuals and entities ordered by the court to pay over Rs 6000 crore owed to RHC Holding Pvt Ltd in connection with the settlement of a dispute to Daiichi Sankyo’s acquisition of Ranbaxy laboratories.

Teena Thacker

The Delhi High Court has ordered Gurinder Singh Dhillon, chief of Radha Soami Satsang Beas (RSSB) to be personally present in the court on November 14.

The order comes after he and his family members told the court that they do not owe any money to RHC Holding Pvt Ltd, promoted by Malvinder and Shivinder Singh.

The Dhillon had filed an application following the court’s direction to deposit the amount owed to RHC holdings pvt Ltd in connection with the execution of Rs 3500 crore arbitration award won by Japanese form Daiichi Sankyoagainst former Ranbaxy promoters. In his plea Dhillon had told the court that RHC Holding has made false claims.

Thereafter, in an order dated October 11 the court ordered Dhillon along with his wife Shabnam, sons Gurkirat and Gurpreet and daughter in law Nayan Tara to “remain present in the court with relevant documents related to their dealings and transactions with the garnishees and their related companies,” the order said. ET has accessed a copy of the order.

The Dhillon are among 55 individuals and entities ordered by the court to pay over Rs 6000 crore owed to RHC holding in connection with the settlement of a dispute to Daiichi Sankyo’s acquisition of Ranbaxy laboratoriesNSE 5.63 %.

Justice JR Midha in his earlier order had also stated that these entities cannot “dispose of, alienate, encumber directly or indirectly, part with the possession of any assets, except in the ordinary course of business like payment of salary and statutory dues, till the next date of hearing.”

According to an affidavit filed by RHC Holding in April, entities including those controlled by the RSSB chief, his family and close associates, owed over Rs 6,000 crore to the company and other group entities of the Singh brothers. Malvinder Singh, one of the directors of RHC, had maintained that payment of an arbitration award related to Daiichi Sankyo’s acquisition of Ranbaxy could be made only if the money owed was recovered.

Gurinder Singh Dhillon

Comments

[Neon]

A godman going to court! Who wouldve thunk!!

[Mike England]

Oh man
I thought the punchline was gonna be Oct 26.
Now it’s dragged out for another 2 weeks.

When will this madness end.

[LOST]

So...looks like what is owed is much much less.....And they have loaned money to other family members.

https://www.thehindubusinessline.com/companies/former-fortis-promoters-to-face-radha-soamiguru-in-court-on-november-14/article29702379.ece#

[Spence Tepper]

Tick tock...

[Spence Tepper]

The order came last week, following Gurinder's plea of innocence. Buy its not his trial.

[Jesse]

LOST, you found the worst media company of all time somehow. They can't even get his name right. It's understandable since almost everyone is a jeet, meet, preet, or inder, but their only single job is to copy other stories and get the names correct.

"The RSSB guru Gurpreet Dhillon and his family owe over ₹215 crore to brothers Malvinder and Shivinder Singh "

[Vinny]

Nothingness Version 3.2 = Industry on confiscated properties and criminals staring at whitewashed jail walls with cronies pounded for abetting crime.

[Believer]

I think it's better to wait & watch,
order to appear in court doesn't mean that baba ji is guilty, let the Honourable High Court decide it...
Even in case of his family members found guilty, still we can not link this
with baba ji until he personally involved in it...
He is standing with his family in capacity of a husband & a father not a spiritual Guru...

[Lata]

The entire issue is so absurd that anyone can dream of involving babaji in this case involving money.Money and Babaji dont have a relationship o ye of brains that arem non functional.And this is not faith.It is the truth.Lata khubchandani

[Naveen]

It is strange but true, Law is equal for everyone. And it is said in the context above where Gurinder Singh Dhillon who calls himself God in human Form will now be in Court trying to defend him and his family owing thousands of crores of Rupees to Singh Brothers.

Ascetics in the ancient India used to live a life of a भिक्षुक living on ounces with utmost simplicity and absolutely no worldly possessions. Not even family.

But here Money is so important today that even such Ascetics that call themselves God in human form have to have worldly possessions and not just possessions these are one exceptional that have millions and millions of Rupees, a private jet and thousands of hectares of land banks in all the corners of India as well as Abroad...

[Surinder chugh]

I believe babajiis not giluity.

[Nick GB]

The key issue I keep returning to is not guilt or innocence but why is the RSSB head caught up in all this money grubbing, power mongering and general high jinks! The rest of us are encouraged to lead a semi austere almost ascetic commitment to meditative quiet and detachment from gross involvement with worldly life. It is flagrant hypocrisy and lack of leadership or am I missing something? Nothing wrong with money as such, except how it is obtained. Also the ethical considerations are steamrollered and 'honest living' does not appear anywhere in sight. Again am I missing something? Of the ways Gurus fall off their perch this is perhaps one the less heinous; compared to sex scandals, violence and general exploitation of followers. However still no real example to anyone still involved with the sect!

[K.Singh]

RSSB With 5000 centres Worldwide is worth an estimated 95 Thousand crores Rupees.For example there is Youtube story of RSSB Delhi Dera squaters eviction ,where followers stoned the Police which assisted eviction over 5 .5 acres of land .Rate of land in this area is between 6 to 40 Crore per Acre. Government is in process of evicting RSSB from 135 Acres Dera in another location of Delhi.RSSB had close connections with Indira Gandhi and family they let them take over lot of Government land.Even at time of previous Guru RSSB had very close relations with Premier Indira Gandhi.

[Sushil]

Nothing but race to dera beas for holding it at any cost. Even nearer donot have faith in spirtulisum. May I request malvinder & savinder to refrain to acques to dera radha soami.

[Satish Chander]

Our Babaji knows better than so-called thinktankers whose motive is only to criticise, criticise & criticise because they don,t have digestive power. So don,t cry and have patience.

[navneet]

all the matter will solved
babaji have all the answers

[KAMAL BACHANI]

Clear case of crooked brothers and cousins trying to get advantage out of a well managed trust for last more than 100 yrs, to settle their personal dues. Present trustee of RSSB, Mr. Gurinder Singh is a very gentle person and a loving brother, most importantly a reputed and clean businessman.

[a wise owl]

RSSB With 5000 centres Worldwide is worth an estimated 95 Thousand crores Rupees.For example there is Youtube story of RSSB Delhi Dera squaters eviction ,where followers stoned the Police which assisted eviction over 5 .5 acres of land .Rate of land in this area is between 6 to 40 Crore per Acre. Government is in process of evicting RSSB from 135 Acres Dera in another location of Delhi.RSSB had close connections with Indira Gandhi and family they let them take over lot of Government land.Even at time of previous Guru RSSB had very close relations with Premier Indira Gandhi.
Posted by: K.Singh | October 17, 2019 at 02:06 AM

Three parts - (1) political leaning (2) preferential land allocation (3) 95k crores worth

(1) connections with the Gandhis: never heard this one. Anything to back this up? Even any verbal communication? Dera Beas isn't aligned to Congress for some time now. Dead sure about this.

(2) preferential land allocation: eviction is news. Demolitions I had heard. Again, anything material on the eviction bit and preferential allocation bit.

(3) 95k crores - amazing. How do you know this or arrive at this figure?

[Guru]

Singh brothers in Tihar jail till 31 October..
https://www.ndtv.com/india-news/ex-fortis-promoters-malvinder-singh-and-shivinder-sent-to-14-day-judicial-custody-2118300

[Jesse]

"Mr. Gurinder Singh is a very gentle person and a loving brother, most importantly a reputed and clean businessman."

Stated without evidence.

He's quite obviously not "clean" since he's become massively rich without having a job.

[Sina]

Non of these games can penetrate or shake the faith of RS followers. Nice try though!

Any person who deal with large finance may go to court and defend his/her act and face consequences. Thats the business not spiritual game!
In fact, that has nothing to do with spiritual body of RSSB, in which not only provide free services to public but also engages in contributing projects.
Be careful!
These individuals who get excited about diminishing our master will cheer up for diminishing anyone. Excitement feeds their ego.

With love and wisdom

[Sina]

Or in simple words;
If a Goldman gets hungry, he will have some food because he lives in the body
So,
If a Godman does business he get involved with business's ups and down because that is the game he is playing.

And this, has nothing to do with him being a Budha or a simple person .
I hope this helps you lot!

[brijesh]

there is no doubt that in india you cheap people make all the decision by yourself it seems like you are judge of supreme court just wait and watch atleast wait for the decision of court.

[Vijay]

Nick GB
You may not have any involvement but if mud is thrown your way by others you will get dirty.
You may be a safe driver following all
The rules to the T but if a careless one bumps into you, you still will have to deal with the damage.
Same thing hope this somehow answers your question.

[Jaidev Sharma]

Foolish brothers lost 22500 crores in last ten years and now a well reputed trust is being brought into picture. Every one will see that non involvement of Dera in this context very soon.Lets wait and watch.

[drsatpurush]

"
(1) connections with the Gandhis: never heard this one. Anything to back this up? Even any verbal communication? Dera Beas isn't aligned to Congress for some time now. Dead sure about this.

(2) preferential land allocation: eviction is news. Demolitions I had heard. Again, anything material on the eviction bit and preferential allocation bit.

(3) 95k crores - amazing. How do you know this or arrive at this figure? "

1. they are the money launderers for gandhis. note abhishek manu singhvi is the lawyer used by chidambaram and singhs too. this goes all the way to london and the queen. just like mallya they loot and send the money back to london. corruption capital of the world.
2. can confirm this anecdotally
3. i wouldn't be surprised.

[CommonSenseIsaRareSense]

matter of time before they all go to jail....gurpreet singhs (babjis son) address in court complaint is nassim park residences singapore.....

the houses start at 60 crores....go figure....and the morons of RSSB give away their hard earned money trying to gain enlightenment through a crook

[Georgy Porgy]

Judas

Total sell-out.

Trying to avoid ruin rather than copping it for their own poor management. GSD ain’t an officer of the business, nor did he run it.

Now these desperados reckon the guru can save their hide. Guru can’t help if you fkup. Face the music, front and center.

[commonsense]

apparently the crooked baba has been flown to singapore on advice of doctors....he will be a no show at court.....
matter of time before he is put in jail

[Randy Reginald]

Is it just me or are there a number of v fishy Indian legal proceedings here:

1. When was last time you heard any company having to repay money after it had been acquired? M&A is ‘buyer beware’. You buy a lemon it’s your own stoopid.

2. After money is paid for a company it is virtually immediately re-invested - how the hell did you actually expect to recover it.

3. Ain’t true such a thing a legal personality and limited liability? Since when are individual officers of a company deemed liability for a corporate debt or judgement?

4. There might be rare cases when company officers are held liable, but I’ve never heard of individuals who don’t even run the business being liable for a corporate deal or debt.

5. The good guys will prevail.

[anami]

Most of us here are RSSB initiates, even the renegades. If you have faith in our Satgurus, then have faith in their judgment to include us. Malvinder and Shivinder too. We have our roles in this drama, wherever it goes.

[grapelove]

Worth reading again I think:
RSSB chief Baba Gurinder Dhillon's associates threatened me with life, alleges filmmaker Sheetal Talwar
Received death threats on phone after lawyers pursued unpaid $1.25 million towards Baba's treatment abroad.

https://www.businesstoday.in/current/economy-politics/rssb-chief-baba-gurinder-dhillon-associates-threatened-me-with-life-alleges-filmmaker-sheetal-talwar/story/331467.html

[Jesse]

drsatpurush, do you also believe that Sonia Gandhi is a multi trillionaire working for the Italian mafia?

A lot of people believe really stupid things. Most of what you're saying looks lifted from Captain Vadakayils schizophrenia archives.

[K.Singh]

Every prominant Dera in India in the last 200 Years is created/funded by the Rulers.Sikh Empire ended in 1849 by the British.Defeated Warrior Sikhs were attacking British.To counter this they took up the srvices of Hindu priests to make Sikhs cool/non violent like Hindu,s .Pundit Tara Hari Narotam from Qudian near Beas was the head of Haridwar (All India)Mahant(Hindu)Akhara. He was teaching people Like Jaimal Singh(Founder of Beas) and Surat Singh (Dera Mehta ) Nirankari Baba and many others sikhs doing military service.All the origianl (Punjabi )Guru,s created by British were employees of British Army.First non-military Master was after Indepence in 1948 Jagat Singh a professor(1948-1951) at this time Dera was only a small place.Baba Charan Singh a British educated Barrister was next (1951-1990).By the 1970,s Dera,s started by British/Tara Hari Narotam had split into many factions fighting amongst one another.Dera Mehta was now headed by Jarnail Singh Bhindravale who was in violent confrontation with Nirankari Dera.Around this time Premier Indira Gandhi was training her son Sanjay gandhi and unelected Sanjay was making decisions.Sanjay wanted to eliminate Akali Dal (Punjab regional Party) that was strong opponent of Congress party. He and Giani Zail singh decided to fund Dera,s in Punjab to create unrest for Punjab Govt led by Akalis backed by traditional Gurudwara,s . Lot of land around Beas was bought at market value and later handed over to Dera Beas for peanuts.Dera Mehta led by Jarnail Singh Bhindravale was creating unrest for Akali Govt funded by central Congress Govt.(He later turned against his paymasters just like Bin laden did against his creators).Rahul Gandhi turned up recently at Dera Beas was driven around by Dhillon himself.Sonia gandhi has been to see the Master Many times.Dera Beas is the third largest land owner in India after Govt of India and Indian Railway.Many of the Masters servants have Houses more than 20 Crore.At one time Dhillon family was major shareholder in Religare Aviation that owned 11 Aircraft and number of Helicopters with licenced routes to Singapore and internal Indian Airports and Pilot training Scool. Baba does not like his photo being taken in Public but his Empire included Vistaar Religare ,India,s first SEBI registered film fund .Other Dera Guru Hardev Singh (Nirankari) died 3 Years ago and left estate worth 65 thousand Crore.Dera Beas has lot more assetts and followers than Nirankari Baba.Just a Guide that 5 Acres land RSSB was evicted from in Delhi was worth 100 Crore .Some of the Dera,s like Chandigarh have 100,s of acres of land where land is so expensive that it is valued by inches and square foots.Plight of the poor small farmers of 22 Villages who lost their land to Dera Beas is not at all recognised by Indian Media.Many still own small plots of land inside the walled Dera but the land has been built over.Dera has also diverted the river Beas away from Dera resulting in flooding of land belonging to adjoining Villages.

[drsatpurush]

K Singh
your detailed account is interesting and clearly brings out the links between beas and gandhis. I wouldn't be surprised if beas is the HQ for the drug menace gripping Punjab either seeing its links with congress.

[K.Singh]

drsatpursh .
Well ,Bikram Majithia is married to Granddaughter of Baba Charan Singh.Everyone in Punjab knows Majithia.Do not know what Baba Charan Singh would have said to his Granddaughter about her factory in UP (Uttar pardesh) distilling many thousands of litres of alcohol every day.

[RSSB is FINISHED]

To all who still believe

malvinder and shivinder made the guru and his sons into billionaires.
any decent person would help them now

but instead the guru refuses to return borrowed money
and also the money borrowed from Talwar. why not return it?
this is not anything spiritual

[Jesse]

Just so non Indians understand, this K Singh and drsatpurush team is standard Punjabi propaganda and it's not really worth reading.

If you talk to hindutva types they'll say some Christian organization owns the most land in India. They all repeat the same lines but substitute one enemy for another and praise their own group. It's not even subtle or well thought out.

The long diatribe about the Sikh "empire" is likely copypasta not even written by K Singh, and it's full of the standard self aggrandizing mythologies of a warrior caste taken down by clever Brahmins. If the British are responsible, it's for those warrior myths, not for assisting Brahmins.

Look at the main benefactors of British rule. It's been Sikhs almost entirely. They squandered their small kingdom sometimes referred to as an empire, and post partition continued squandering the immense wealth they'd been given on fancy items, gaudy mcmansions and drugs.

For those who think that India is conspiring to make them all drug addicts, ask yourself why they still do drugs, drink and commit crimes at higher rates than almost anyone else... IN CANADA.

[Jagga]

K. Singh ji
Please shower more such invaluable information upon us.

[Principal Subhash Arora]

Randy Reginald has posted comments on 17 Oct based on Universal Corporate and Company Law.
It is prematured decision to ask Baba Gurinder Singh Dhillon and his family to appear in court without ascertaining contents of Affidavit filed by him and before deadline given to all for returning borrowed sum . Debentures to Dhillons are not fraudulant but legal financial instrument

[Bimol Sharma]

Mark Twain prounced
"Write What You know "
let the courts in Ondia decide the future of all concerned. Be it anyone

[cocky me]

drsatpursh .
Well ,Bikram Majithia is married to Granddaughter of Baba Charan Singh.Everyone in Punjab knows Majithia.Do not know what Baba Charan Singh would have said to his Granddaughter about her factory in UP (Uttar pardesh) distilling many thousands of litres of alcohol every day.

Posted by: K.Singh | October 17, 2019 at 02:16 PM

Charan would have said nothing to his grand daughter.

Bikram Majitha - Congress??

[a wise owl]

Just so non Indians understand, this K Singh and drsatpurush team is standard Punjabi propaganda and it's not really worth reading.

If you talk to hindutva types they'll say some Christian organization owns the most land in India. They all repeat the same lines but substitute one enemy for another and praise their own group. It's not even subtle or well thought out.

The long diatribe about the Sikh "empire" is likely copypasta not even written by K Singh, and it's full of the standard self aggrandizing mythologies of a warrior caste taken down by clever Brahmins. If the British are responsible, it's for those warrior myths, not for assisting Brahmins.

Look at the main benefactors of British rule. It's been Sikhs almost entirely. They squandered their small kingdom sometimes referred to as an empire, and post partition continued squandering the immense wealth they'd been given on fancy items, gaudy mcmansions and drugs.

For those who think that India is conspiring to make them all drug addicts, ask yourself why they still do drugs, drink and commit crimes at higher rates than almost anyone else... IN CANADA.

Posted by: Jesse | October 17, 2019 at 02:44 PM

Interesting retort.

On land ownership - do include the miniscule Parsi community. Their land holdings have eye popping values as most of it is in Mumbai. An article says about 20% of Mumbai habitable land is owned by 9. 6 of them happen to be Parsis.

Politicians - will feel offended surely. One prominent India politician is rumoured to own 40% of a city close to Mumbai.

The two gents are in kindergarten still.

Sikhs - main benefactor of British rule - I would say again it's the Parsis. Most households still have a photo of the queen. LoL

[a wise owl]

(1) connections with the Gandhis: never heard this one. Anything to back this up? Even any verbal communication? Dera Beas isn't aligned to Congress for some time now. Dead sure about this.
(2) preferential land allocation: eviction is news. Demolitions I had heard. Again, anything material on the eviction bit and preferential allocation bit.
(3) 95k crores - amazing. How do you know this or arrive at this figure? "
1. they are the money launderers for gandhis. note abhishek manu singhvi is the lawyer used by chidambaram and singhs too. this goes all the way to london and the queen. just like mallya they loot and send the money back to london. corruption capital of the world.
2. can confirm this anecdotally
3. i wouldn't be surprised.
Posted by: drsatpurush | October 17, 2019 at 09:20 AM

1. who is they that you refer to? So in effect what you STATE here is that a Prominent Indian Political Family INDULGES IN MONEY LAUNDERING, this money all lands up in London and that London is the capital of corruption. What is it you ALLUDE ABOUT the eminent brilliant lawyer Mr Manu Singhvi ? Chidambaram to my knowledge has a battery of lawyers and Kapil Sibal is at pole. I could be wrong. Chidambaram bores me.

2. an anecdotal confirmation - extremely helpful. I though the judicial process is that the Land Authorities (Govt) would have sent a legal eviction notice and which should be able via RTI. Do us a favour - invoke RTI and get us the eviction notice. This one is for both you fella - Satpursh and K Singh

3. you wouldn't be surprised. is this the point? My interest is to know the source of arriving at this number and not if you are surprised or not. So if you can help great. Anyways I am sure K Singh will soon divulge the source/how the number has been arrived at.

[a wise owl]

(1) connections with the Gandhis: never heard this one. Anything to back this up? Even any verbal communication? Dera Beas isn't aligned to Congress for some time now. Dead sure about this.
(2) preferential land allocation: eviction is news. Demolitions I had heard. Again, anything material on the eviction bit and preferential allocation bit.
(3) 95k crores - amazing. How do you know this or arrive at this figure? "
1. they are the money launderers for gandhis. note abhishek manu singhvi is the lawyer used by chidambaram and singhs too. this goes all the way to london and the queen. just like mallya they loot and send the money back to london. corruption capital of the world.
2. can confirm this anecdotally
3. i wouldn't be surprised.
Posted by: drsatpurush | October 17, 2019 at 09:20 AM

1. who is they that you refer to? So in effect what you STATE here is that a Prominent Indian Political Family INDULGES IN MONEY LAUNDERING, this money all lands up in London and that London is the capital of corruption. What is it you ALLUDE ABOUT the eminent brilliant lawyer Mr Manu Singhvi ? Chidambaram to my knowledge has a battery of lawyers and Kapil Sibal is at pole. I could be wrong. Chidambaram bores me.

2. an anecdotal confirmation - extremely helpful. I though the judicial process is that the Land Authorities (Govt) would have sent a legal eviction notice and which should be able via RTI. Do us a favour - invoke RTI and get us the eviction notice. This one is for both you fella - Satpursh and K Singh

3. you wouldn't be surprised. is this the point? My interest is to know the source of arriving at this number and not if you are surprised or not. So if you can help great. Anyways I am sure K Singh will soon divulge the source/how the number has been arrived at.

[drsatpurush]

"For those who think that India is conspiring to make them all drug addicts, ask yourself why they still do drugs, drink and commit crimes at higher rates than almost anyone else... IN CANADA."

Jesse who supplies them with drugs in Canada? Hint: it isn't the indian state!

"Sikhs - main benefactor of British rule - I would say again it's the Parsis. Most households still have a photo of the queen. LoL"

Weren't Tata Sons, the Parsis - under British rule the biggest drug dealer in india? of course he also has a GBE knight or such title from the queen.

i don't think the drugs business globally has changed hands yet from where it was a few hundred years ago.

[K.Singh]

Wise Owl
RSSB entered into a written agreement in July this year with small farmers whose lands are within the Dera Beas,The Dera has since backtracked from this written agreement to Identify the plots through local registrar and they started a demonstaration under the Beas Road bridge lead by Baldev Singh Sirsa.Last week demonstrators decided to burn effigy of Dhillon but they were picked up by Police and sent to jail/remand.All they are asking that theier lands within the Dera be identified.This includes a disabled farmer who has won High Court order after 10 years of Court litigation that his 8 acres of land is within the Dera walls. Only punjabi media is covering this.This baba controls the Punjab Police through Punjab Chief Minister.One woman this week has alleged and named a RSSB associate on live SIKH TV UK that she was raped by the named person but Police si refusing to register her complaint.The demonstrators are also claiming that theier legal documents were seized by the Police and never returned.

[a wise 🦉]

apparently the crooked baba has been flown to singapore on advice of doctors....he will be a no show at court.....
matter of time before he is put in jail

Posted by: commonsense | October 17, 2019 at 09:55 AM

Are you by any chance implying that GSD has fled the country under the garb of medical treatment and so no show at courts??? I think instead of commenting in here you must inform the authorities about the likely so show!!! LoL

' apparently he has been flown" is what you say. You unsure is it that you say apparently? and its against his wishes is it?

So yes he flew to Singapore after the Delhi programme. Now whether he flies to Singapore or however he decides to spend his free time - his prerogative - it's common sense which is missing in you.

20th October is the first of the three Sunday discourses by GSD in Beas and having returned around midnight he was on stage today i.e. Friday 18th October - only for the sangat I suppose.

And yes,

"The mimic Gurus like Lane won't even dream to have even one from this sangat sitting in some lame Villa in California." So says a Pundit I know.

[commonsense]

a wise 🦉.....believing in a dhongi baba and calling your handle name "a wise"...thats what i deem as missing common sense...

believing in a human being who is no different than us in flesh and blood as god is what i would say is foolish...aka missing common sense.

[Jim Sutherland]

Wise Owl writes,...” The mimic Gurus like Lane won't even dream to have even one from this sangat sitting in some lame Villa in California." So says a Pundit I know.“

Me: Only the RICH Indian Beas Satsangis that can afford Airfare and Travel will make their yearly Safari to Get Lanji’s Darshan and Wits of a Wisdom at Palm Desert, California. All of the rest of his Satsangis, world wide, will be able to tune in, live, to see and hear him on the Web., or subscribe to his podcasts, if they have been initiated, but, all of his Satsangs will be recorded and spoken in a English. But, unlike Gurinder’s, Laneji loves attention and exposure, and hides from no one, especially his Critics, who are his best friends.
As for the Dera at Beas, there will be no Squatters left there, because the entire Settlement will have been confiscated by Creditors, and auctioned to Buyers who have money to buy the individual Parcels from the Developers.
The Spiritual Shift from East to West will have happened in spite of the Indian Stronghold on RSSB.
Jim Sutherland

[Jesse]

"One woman this week has alleged and named a RSSB associate on live SIKH TV UK..."

Sikh TV UK. I'm sure they're completely unbiased and don't fabricate the most obviously false stories regularly to stir up drama in the "panth."

"The demonstrators are also claiming that their legal documents were seized by the Police and never returned."

How convenient that this is what always happens. Literally every time. It's like Scooby Doo cartoons where you were just about to get away with something, but the meddling kids caught you.

I'm basically anti-RSSB, but you Khalistani types are way more annoying.

We should remind ourselves that the Sikh "court" known as the Akal Takht has given decrees stating all non-Sikhs must leave the state of Punjab. Sikhs used mass violence in the past to make this happen. As they fight to ethnically, and religiously cleanse the Punjab of bhaiyas (the more brown and more hindu neighbors to their east) and deras, they simultaneously and hypocritically portray themselves as human rights leaders, and agitate as "anti-racists" who respect all religions and whatnot in the west... Except in UK where they attack black people who marry Sikh women. But that's a different issue.

Point is, there are legitimate concerns regarding RSSB, and none of them are coming from the SIkh community who should be ignored.

[drsatpurush]

"I'm basically anti-RSSB, but you Khalistani types are way more annoying."

khalistani - i wonder if the word means empty in the head?

"Point is, there are legitimate concerns regarding RSSB, and none of them are coming from the SIkh community who should be ignored."

mostly agree. Canadian sikhs have been placed in high positions in the government and all worship the uk and queen and probably support khalistan. no wonder they dont complain about RSSB.

[K.Singh]

Jesse
Shame on people who mock disabled victims of RSSB like Rajinder Singh Dhilwan who can not get his land back even after 10 Years of litigation in Courts.Your RSSB estate managers signed an agreement in presence of DSP Bakala Ravinder Singh and Tehsildar Kapurthalla that Rajinder Singh will apply for de-markation of land and within 7 days the registrar will mark the land belonging to Rajinder Singh.He made the application,paid the fee but marking has not taken place due to phone calls from the top.
You remind me of follwers of Ram Rahim (another off shoot of Dera Beas Master Sawan Singh diciple Shah Mastan).Ram Rahim is in jail but his followers like you are saying that Godman has gone there to salvage the World.

[Whodunit]

It's getting kinda fun interesting here, the hate paradigm has shifted
RSSB haters 1 CotC vs RSSB haters 2 Khalistan Sikhs

Funny that 500 years ago there were no Sikhs on the planet.
1400 years ago there were no Muslims
2000 years ago there were no Christians
2500 years ago there were no Buddhists
3500 there were no Jews or Israelites

In 100 years time there will be a new religion called Radha Soami

But hatred for one caste or creed or religion or another will forever remain.

[JS]

To my mind, the only 2 questions that need to be answered now are;

- Just how much evidence do the Indian authorities need before they arrest Gurinder Singh Dhillon as part of the Religare fraud? Clearly his standing is preventing them from bringing him, for now

If the information provided by Bloomberg was incorrect, why didn’t the ”Holy Man” sue then for libel?

- What will the Delhi High Court do when Gurinder Singh Dhillon fails for pay the Daichi award?

If he had the money, he’d have paid it back a long time ago. And, if he didn’t owe the money, why wait until the 11th hour to state that?

The clock is ticking and, as we approach the thrilling climax, I for one am eagerly awaiting one hell of a grande finale!

[Jesse]

K Singh, I never mocked that particular "disabled person." I never mentioned him in any way at all, actually. So keep your BS to yourself, clown.

I understand that you're semi illiterate and an unskilled propagandist, but you surely can read well enough to know that I wrote that I am anti-RSSB. I've been ranting about how corrupt I think that baba Gurinder is for over a year. He's almost as corrupt as the Akal Takht, the SGPC and the rest of Sikhism.

Now while you're feigning moral outrage and pretending to be innocent, should we get into the decades long campaign of international terror of the mainstream Sikh religion, Mr Singh? Would you like to discuss the fact that your religion has the highest rate of female infanticide on earth?

I know how you guys work. It's not very sophisticated.

[Jesse]

"Canadian sikhs have been placed in high positions in the government and all worship the uk and queen and probably support khalistan. no wonder they dont complain about RSSB."

Canadian Sikhs complain non-stop about RSSB between their daily outbreaks of violence inside Gurdwaras.

"In 100 years time there will be a new religion called Radha Soami "

It already exists as a formal religion today. David Lane, instead of humoring babas and their tall tales of mystic visions, should have studied the process of how religions develop in real time. RS is a perfect case study.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u8Pv8nb3A0I

[Spence Tepper]

Hi Randy Reginald
You ask
"1. When was last time you heard any company having to repay money after it had been acquired? M&A is ‘buyer beware’. You buy a lemon it’s your own stoopid."

Every company that is acquired is expected to perform well and return the original investment in a short period of time. The company acquired has fees to the corporation every pay period. That's where their profit goes.

You appear unfamiliar with standard mergers and acquisitions practice.

[Spence Tepper]

Hi Randy Reginald
You wrote
"4. There might be rare cases when company officers are held liable, but I’ve never heard of individuals who don’t even run the business being liable for a corporate deal or debt."

Happens all time: Bernie Madoff, Ken Lay, Jeff Skilling... Happened all the time. Fraud is a criminal act and any individual can be held liable. You are confusing civil law violations, as well as insolvency, which normally cannot be used against individual principles in a corporation, only the corporation. But criminal offenses like theft and fraud, anyone can be accused, tried and thrown in jail.

Also, if anyone receives stolen monies, even without their knowledge, they can be held liable to return that money.

And if someone receives a legitimate loan with interest, they are most certainly liable for repayment according to the terms of the loan.

There is no escape here.

[Osho Robbins]

500 years ago a man said
“There are no Hindus nor Muslims”

He was against all divisions and said all humans are equal.

Then his own followers created the Khalsa and before you know it, another “ism” was born

Radha soami is now also another religion because people call themselves Radha soamis despite the efforts to keep it as a “science of the soul”
More than just a sign outside Haynes is needed to drop the religion aspect.

It’s only a matter of time before Radha soami will have their own Marriage ceremony because Sikhs are now against anyone doing the anand karaj unless they are proper Sikhs

How far things have come from the days of Nanak.

If Nanak was around today he would denounce Sikhism.

Kind of funny that the person who is credited as the founder of Sikhism would stand against it today

[Jesse]

"How far things have come from the days of Nanak. "

"Then his own followers created the Khalsa and before you know it, another “ism” was born.
Radha soami is now also another religion because people call themselves Radha soamis"

Students of Nanak had a title as well long before the 10th Guru, and called themselves "Sikh" at Nanak's behest. If having any sort of consciousness of an in-group or using a title makes something a religion, then everyone is sectarian by nature, and early Sikhs were no exception.

There's nothing wrong with in-groups and out-groups or sectarianism per se, but if we're assessing the facts about this case, people should be aware when they're not being presented with facts, but being shown people with disabilities or whatever to benefit their own sect.

When these Khalsa people trot out a land grab victim to use as their weapon, they're no better than the "White Helmets" who are on video chopping off kids' heads, while CNN and MSNBC call them heroes because they film themselves brushing dust off of another kid. Everyone and everything is corrupt. It was the same with Nanak. It'll be the same forever.

[drsatpurush]

Jesse
which one is it? what a switcheroo by you!!
"Canadian Sikhs complain non-stop about RSSB"
OR
""Point is, there are legitimate concerns regarding RSSB, and none of them are coming from the SIkh community""

[Jesse]

drsatpurush, the word "legitimate" isn't a filler sound like "um" or "dadadadadadddrrrrrrrrrrppppaaaa."

Read the quotes you posted again. It says people complain, but their complaints are rarely legitimate.

Plus, I wish I did contradict myself because I don't care about being consistent and I find consistency to be a lie in itself. Except when I don't. I expect people to be consistent when they talk to me. I find consistency to be one of the most important aspects to a conversation. It's hard to trust inconsistent people.

[K.Singh]

"How far things have come from the days of Nanak"
Following Guru Nanak,s teachings Sikhs stopped invasions of tyrants like Abdali who used to raid India every summer ,take thousands of Hindu women as war booty and sell them in Kabul bazar.Sikhs ruled an area of 190 thousand square Miles ,twice the size of UK .Then East India trading Company set up their stall in Calcutta and ruled Hindustan but not Punjab.British had their eyes set on Punjab and bribed Brahmins to create new Dera,s in Punjab and introduced new Granth,s promoting drugs and living Guru,s that started the fall of sikh empire.The fake granths introduced by the British are main reason for Sikh factions .

[Whodunit]

First 5 gurus
Nanak, Angad, Amar Das, Ram Das, Arjan, were true spiritual gurus.

Ram Das established Amritsar as Sikhs temple and spiritual center.

After Arjan it became a religious institution like every religion before it, it had been inspired by its founders and true tenets and experiences taught through direct associations and methods. Arjan collected and compiled Guru Granth Sahib as Sikhs holy teaching.

After Arjan's execution by Mogul emperor Jahangir, his 11 year old son Hargobind was thrust into carrying the religion of his fathers heritage forward.
At this point it became a religion with social and institutionalized rules and cultural customs as well as political aspects for preserving cultural differences from others in society.

By the time of Guru Hargobind, a guru both became a spiritual and military leader.

Hence last 5 'Guru's'
Hargobind, Har Rai, Har Krishnan, Tegh Bahadur, and Gobind Singh were religious and political and military leaders but not necessarily true spiritual teachers or spiritual Guru's.

[Daljit]

@ Whodunit,

Can the same logic be applied to Radhasoamis?
The earlier Radhasoami Gurus were true spiritual Gurus.
The later and current Radhasoami Guru are business man

[Jesse]

Why are you all wasting time cutting and pasting kindergarten level fake Sikh history?

[slave_of_GSD]

@ Whodunit,

Can the same logic be applied to Radhasoamis?
The earlier Radhasoami Gurus were true spiritual Gurus.
The later and current Radhasoami Guru are business man

Posted by: Daljit | October 20, 2019 at 08:58 AM

Apply this logic to the RSSB lineage and GSD is the 5th.

LoL

[Daljit]

let me count. This is my understanding i may he wrong.

1. Swami Ji,
2. Salig Ram,
3. Jaimal Singh,
4. Sawan Singh,
5. Jagat Singh,
6. Charan Singh,
7. Gurinder Singh

[Hukum]

Rssb gurus
Jaimal, Sawan, Jagat, Charan, Gurinder.

Jagat Singh interim caretaker guru 1948-1951 true guru successor of Sawan

Soami Ji and Saligram not Rssb line originating Dayal Bagh Agra

[Gumshuda Bachha by Peela Gubbara]

Daljit , you say: let me count. This is my understanding i may he wrong.

1. Swami Ji,
2. Salig Ram,
3. Jaimal Singh,
4. Sawan Singh,
5. Jagat Singh,
6. Charan Singh,
7. Gurinder Singh

You are and I can correct you. RSSB lineage is #3 onward, hence Babaji is 5th,

[Gumshuda Bachha by Peela Gubbara]

I've been reading Brian's blogs since 2012, off the top of my head (I only visit his RSSB forum although I know there is a lot of other meaningful content on this website). But I've never posted a comment here. It's against the code of conduct for an initiate to talk about RSSB matters on the internet, you know, so...

But what I have seen on this blog is, apart from a few commentators (and those have been mostly recent ones as this story has reached a tipping point) most of the participants, led by Brian of course, seem to know what they're talking about. A few recent comments on this and some of the other posts have been rather ill-informed and purely made out (com)passion or should I say the usual 'I am a Santsangi' arrogance, the likes of one Mira for example who was going to about "your God" and "my God".

As a 32 yo Satsangi who got initiated at 27, I haven't spent decades trying to catch the bell sound or visualize the bursting star or squeeze past Banknal but I was hoping to retire at 40. I had a "goal", I was the chosen one while all others were never going to make it to Sat Lok. Even those that have spent their lives seeing the light were probably going to end up in a "replica" of Trikuti / Par Brahm and end up back on the conveyor belt at the time of the next Pralay or Maha Pralay while I would have driven past them with my Master on the passenger seat all the way past Bhanwar Gupha with a sweet grin on my face.

I still think that Sant Mat or Path of the Masters or Surat Shabd Yoga is probably the only highway to Sach Khand, I am just not sure if the approach we've been told is relevant anymore?

I've read in Ruhani Diary. I reckon, that Saints have a 100 Kuls all sorted with a boarding pass to Sach Khand. So not sure what Shivi and Malav are moaning about aye?

[slave_of_GSD]

let me count. This is my understanding i may he wrong.

1. Swami Ji,
2. Salig Ram,
3. Jaimal Singh,
4. Sawan Singh,
5. Jagat Singh,
6. Charan Singh,
7. Gurinder Singh

Posted by: Daljit | October 20, 2019 at 06:53 PM

Hello Daljit,

You already have a couple of responses and hopefully you will now understand the LoL in my post.
What for that RSSB Representative narrate that 5 Guru spiel to Whodunit??

[Daljit]

This is a twist in the tale. Are you guys saying that RSSB branch does not consider Swami Ji a Guru? Perhaps a tit for tat since Dayalbagh branch does not consider Jaimal Singh and others as Gurus?

While growing up in a staunch Radhasoami family I used to find it weird when Dayalbagh Satsangis refused to attend satsangs of RSSB Gurus and vice versa.

Does Baba Ram Rahim lineage still recognize Jaimal Singh and Sawan Singh as their Gurus? I guess not; a quick visit to their website and their is no mention of Jaimal Singh and Sawan Singh though Wikipedia page mentions their Guru Mastana Balochistani's close interactions with Sawan Singh.

I guess similarly Kirpal Singh branch must have also deleted references to Dayalbagh and RSSB branch.

[Vinny]

This circus of gurudom happens when people become more important than instructions. That is the reason these people became slaves of Britishers. The atomic energy pervading in universe doesn't need any certificate from any guru anywhere in world.

[slave_of_GSD]

The atomic energy pervading in universe doesn't need any certificate from any guru anywhere in world.

Posted by: Vinny | October 21, 2019 at 05:54 AM

Dark energy feels offended @ Vinny.

Heard of dark energy suppose.

[Gurdip Singh]

'NOT GUILTY' until convicted in the court and proved to be guilty. It is too early to label Baba Gurinder Singh of any wrong doing

[Jesse]

"'NOT GUILTY' until convicted in the court and proved to be guilty. It is too early to label Baba Gurinder Singh of any wrong doing"

Wrong. Courts are not my god. I have sufficient evidence for my own judgement.

The legal system of country struggling with extreme corruption is unnecessary.

[One Initiated]

You only have as much evidence as you are fed by the media and the culprits.
It's easy to get carried away.

When Dhillon family submitted legally in writing that they don't owe anything to Religare, they MEAN it. Read the 2013 letter written by Babaji.

The brothers are defrauding the corporate funds since 2003, and proven to be indulged in not one but many corrupt practices, why do you have a reason to believe them that "Dhillons are guilty" is a fact ? that's a no brainer, that doesn't even pass a simple arithmetic logic. Only if you apply that.

If that is mainly because you are already against The Path and just need a reason to point the fingers
on the Masters, that is understandable, however that doesn't hold any value and will not stand justifiable in the court of law.

[Gumshuda Bachha by Peela Gubbara]

"... RSSB branch does not consider Swami Ji a Guru? Perhaps a tit for tat since Dayalbagh branch does not consider Jaimal Singh and others as Gurus?"

I am not sure if this is entirely / at all true. If RSSB didn't consider Soamiji a Guru, they wouldn't be quoting Sar Bachan as widely as they do. At the time of his "draft" as BBJ puts it, he was handed the same shawl that Soamiji had personally handed over to Baba Jaimal Singh,. The other symbolic item that belonged to Soamiji was the wooden pedestal BBJ sat on during the ceremony. Here's the exact moment when that occured - https://youtu.be/iNz7QBPar98?t=4499

As for Dayalbagh branch not considering Jaimal Singh and others as Gurus, that isnt entirely true either. If you read the book Spiritual Letters, Chachajii Maharaj and Maharaj Sawan Singh exchanged many letters even after Baba Jaimal Singh passed on. So did the leaders of Bhandal and other establishments that sprung afterward. The last souvenir that was left at Dayalbagh after Soamiji directed Babaji Maharaj to go to Beas (sending Bibi Rukko along with him from Agra) was a copy of the Adi Granth. Eventually, that was handed over to Sawan Singh as well.

I am not sure where RSSB and Agra deras stand now, but they had a lot of respect for each other during the days of Chachaji, Buaji, Salig Ram and Sawan Singh.

[slave_of_GSD]

@Gumshuda Bachha by Peela Gubbara, Daljit

Symbolic acts and items are irrelevant. Respect is not just towards Agra Deras.

One could say look at the walls of satsang halls, the RSSB offices etc. Whose photos and how many do you see? Does Soamiji figure?

Founder of RSSB is Jaimal Singhji right? So for many many Beas Satsangis, the Beas branch starts with him and makes GSD the fifth whilst the founder of Radha Soami philosophy is Soamiji