Rabbi Goldstein is wrong. A moment of silence in schools is useless.

Rabbi Yisroel Goldstein, who lost a finger in the attack on the Chabad of Poway synagogue where one person was shot to death yesterday, has a perfect right to be deeply upset by what happened to his congregation.

But today I heard Goldstein speak about what he thinks the proper response should be to the attack, and I heartily disagree with him. 

Goldstein said that prayer used to be allowed in public schools. Now, it isn't. Instead, the Rabbi wants every school day to begin with a moment of silence. We should know that God created us, he said.

There's a big problem with this -- the separation of church and state. Children shouldn't be subjected to a religiously-motivated moment of silence, which really would be the only reason for such a practice.

The remarks I heard from Rabbi Goldstein made it clear that he wants God to be reintroduced into public schools. He didn't say why he thinks this would prevent mass shootings, probably because there is no reason to think that it would make any difference  in United States gun violence.

Here's part of a transcription on San Diego Jewish World of remarks made by Rabbi Goldstein. These are close to what I heard on my car radio today, but lack the mentions of God and prayer.

Rabbi Goldstein

And I want to take note for other victims who suffered yesterday, physically, emotionally, spiritually. The best we can do to combat is to grow, build, and be stronger, stronger and stronger.  And yes, every single one of us can do that. I look around at the myriad of cameras that are here.

The message needs to be brought out to the public ‘How does a 19-year-old, a teenager, have the audacity, the sickness, the hatred to publicize such anti-Semitism in [h]is manifesto?  How does he come here to a house of worship to do what he did?’ 

Perhaps we have to go back a little earlier and think about what are we teaching our children?  What are we educating our children?  We need to perhaps consider re-introducing in our public-school system a moment of silence when children can start the day with pausing and thinking, ‘Why am I created?  Why am I here? And what am I going to do?’

After listening to Goldstein speak, I heard a MSNBC panel of experts discuss the synagogue attack. They had a very different take on the cause of anti-Semitism. It was pointed out that anti-Semitic attacks rose by 57% in 2017, the year after Trump was elected. Trump's implicit and explicit endorsement of white nationalism is a likely reason.

A panel member also said that the Department of Homeland Security has eliminated a branch that was focused on combatting domestic terrorism. So the truth, this person said, is that the Trump administration isn't doing everything it should to reduce the threat from people who espouse white supremacy and white nationalism. 

A moment of silence in schools seems wholly inadequate to counteract a president who said, after white nationalist marchers in Charlottesville clashed with protesters, "You also had some very fine people on both sides." Here's what the white nationalist "good people" were chanting in August 2017.

They immediately went after the Jews. At their Friday night rally at the University of Virginia, the white nationalists brandished torches and chanted anti-Semitic and Nazi slogans, including “blood and soil” (an English rendering of the Nazi “blut und boden”) and “Jews will not replace us” — all crafted to cast Jews as foreign interlopers who need to be expunged. The attendees proudly displayed giant swastikas and wore shirts emblazoned with quotes from Adolf Hitler. One banner read, “Jews are Satan’s children.”

Yet I heard Rabbi Goldstein speak approvingly of his 15-minute phone conversation with Trump, who reportedly likes the Rabbi's idea for a (useless) moment of silence in public schools.

Our gun culture is the main reason this country has so many gun deaths. 

I've written about this in quite a few blog posts, such as "U.S.A. has more gun deaths because it has more guns." And Rabbi Goldstein should realize that Israel tightly regulates who can own a gun, as I noted in "Australia and Israel tightly regulate guns. Why can't the United States?"

After every mass shooting there's a call for thoughts and prayers. Which, obviously, do exactly nothing to prevent the next mass shooting. 

Rabbi Goldstein would be better off giving up his nonsensical moment of silence idea, and instead study the chart below from a CNN story, "How U.S. gun culture compares with the world in five charts." The United States is one of the most religious of advanced nations, yet we have by far the most gun-related deaths per 1 million people. 

Hmmmm. Could the reason be that we have almost half of all of the guns in the world, but only 4% of the world's population? Answer: YES.

Comments

[Jesse]

Weird how when some crazy liberal shot 26 or 27 Church goers there was media silence for the most part. Why could that be.... hmmm. Super hard to figure this one out. Did the ADL (who are as bad and dishonest as the splc) mention that? Did they say anything at all about the Muslim bombing of hundreds of Christians just a few days ago? If they did were Christians called "Easter worshipers?" Did many of the ADL's supporters support the death of Christians and Europeans and happily gloat about the burning of notre dame all over twitter? Did you say anything about any of those attacks, or any of the dozens of "trucks of peace" that keep happening in Europe year after year?

If you're gonna cite the ADL you might as well cite anything any random person online says because they use proven hoaxes like the one in Canada last week in their "stats" and they're essentially an ethnic supremacist org that only looks legitimate because the corporate news quotes them as an authority.

You're so lucky to be old. I envy you. These ethnic and religious conflicts are going to get worse than anyone ever imagined and it's gonna suck for everyone who lives in this cursed country. As the Israeli military historian Martin Van Crevald says, immigration is war. And we have people moving from all over the world into the west at higher rates than ever in human history. We're so screwed and almost everyone is either oblivious or missing the forest for the trees by focusing on the incidents instead of the changing atmosphere. Young people would be better off to just move to the woods.

[Dungeness]

We need to perhaps consider re-introducing in our public-school system a moment of silence when children can start the day with pausing and thinking, ‘Why am I created? Why am I here? And what am I going to do?’

Brian, I agree with most of your points but favor the rabbi's
"moment of silence" too. Stricter gun controls in lieu of the
"thoughts and prayers" is a no-brainer. But, at the same time,
we need to look within.

We need ways to start shifting our attention away from the
24x7 distractions available to us. We need to take time to
observe the mind and seek withdrawal from out-of-control
thought. Then we can begin regaining our sanity even as
chaos swirls around us.

That inner awareness will be the start of a more meaningful
journey away from hate and dysfunction. Of course, more
should be done to keep dangerous toys away from mindless
children too...

[s*]

We're so screwed and almost everyone is either oblivious or missing the forest for the trees by focusing on the incidents instead of the changing atmosphere. Young people would be better off to just move to the woods.

Absolutely so Jesse.
What a mess these days.
A lot of youngsters are seeking ''freedom'' in drugs.human history. We're so screwed and almost everyone is either oblivious or missing the forest for the trees by focusing on the incidents instead of the changing atmosphere. Young people would be better off to just move to the woods.
Unfortunaly..
When people were seeking for nature to get the insects back.
Plant trees and look after eachother and live naturaly??
But well..what do I know??
''Why of life??How it goes right now..

[Spence Tepper]

The data on gun violence was conclusive decades ago.
Gun control and improved employment.
But dogma gets in the way of pragmatic solutions.

[Jesse]

"The data on gun violence was conclusive decades ago."

What data was conclusive about what, Spence? If guns existing is the cause of violence from guns, then why don't the number of gun related attacks exactly correlate by country? India of all places has the 2nd highest number of guns yet not the second highest amount of gun violence.

Even if you stick to just America, when you start breaking taboos and break down gun violence (or any violence at all) by race you find that the group with the most guns is vastly underrepresented in gun related crimes per capita and other violent crimes as well.

Plus, who cares what particular tool you get killed or maimed with? I'd probably prefer to be killed by a gun than in the UK or China knife to the gut style. Just sitting there bleeding out of a blade wound while your internal organs slowly fail sounds horrific.

[Spence Tepper]

Hi Jesse
Here you go

"
Child Occupant Protection▼
Concussion and Head Injury▼
Crash Avoidance and Autonomous Vehicles▼
Safe Mobility▼
Teen Driving Safety▼
Traumatic Stress▼
Violence Prevention Initiative▼
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VPI Fellows at CHOP
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VPI Signature Programs▼
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Other Violence Prevention Programs at CHOP▼
»
Types of Violence Involving Youth▼
» »
Bullying in Schools▼
» »
Child Sex Trafficking
» »
Dating Violence▼
» »
Domestic Violence and Child Abuse
» »
Gun Violence▼
» » »
Counseling on Gun Safety in the Home
» » »
Gun Violence: Facts and Statistics
» »
School Shootings▼
» »
Suicide and Self-Harm
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Trauma-informed Care Approach to Child Traumatic Stress▼
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Factors Affecting Youth and Violence
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Resources for Families▼
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Violence Prevention Tools
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VPI Bibliography
Gun Violence: Facts and Statistics
According to the scientific literature, American children face a substantial risk of exposure to firearm injury and death. Following are additional relevant gun violence facts:

In 2016, 4,648 young people ages 10-24 were victims of homicide - an average of 13 each day.
Gun Violence Facts: In the Home
There are more than 393 million guns in circulation in the United States — approximately 120.5 guns for every 100 people.
1.7 million children live with unlocked, loaded guns - 1 out of 3 homes with kids have guns.
In 2015, 2,824 children (age 0 to 19 years) died by gunshot and an additional 13,723 were injured.
An emergency department visit for non-fatal assault injury places a youth at 40 percent higher risk for subsequent firearm injury.
Those people that die from accidental shooting were more than three times as likely to have had a firearm in their home as those in the control group.
Among children, the majority (89%) of unintentional shooting deaths occur in the home. Most of these deaths occur when children are playing with a loaded gun in their parent’s absence.
People who report “firearm access” are at twice the risk of homicide and more than three times the risk of suicide compared to those who do not own or have access to firearms.
Suicide rates are much higher in states with higher rates of gun ownership, even after controlling for differences among states for poverty, urbanization, unemployment, mental illness, and alcohol or drug abuse.
Among suicide victims requiring hospital treatment, suicide attempts with a firearm are much more deadly than attempts by jumping or drug poisoning — 90 percent die compared to 34 percent and 2 percent respectively. About 90 percent of those that survive a suicide attempt do not go on to die by suicide.
States implementing universal background checks and mandatory waiting periods prior to the purchase of a firearm show lower rates of suicides than states without this legislation. To read more about suicide and firearms, click here.
In states with increased gun availability, death rates from gunshots for children were higher than in states with less availability.
The vast majority of accidental firearm deaths among children are related to child access to firearms — either self-inflicted or at the hands of another child.
Studies have shown that states with Child Access Prevention (CAP) laws laws have a lower rate of unintentional death than states without CAP laws.
Domestic violence is more likely to turn deadly with a gun in the home. An abusive partner’s access to a firearm increases the risk of homicide eight-fold for women in physically abusive relationships. Read more about the impact of child exposure to domestic violence.
Safe Storage of Guns in the Home
The U.S. General Accounting Office estimated that 31 percent of accidental deaths caused by firearms might be prevented with the addition of two devices: a child-proof safety lock and a loading indicator.
Approximately one of three handguns guns is kept loaded and unlocked and most children know where their parents keep their guns.
More than 75 percent of first and second graders know where their parents keep their firearms and 36 percent admitted handling the weapons, contradicting their parents’ reports.
More than 80 percent of guns used by youth in suicide attempts were kept in the home of the victim, a relative, or a friend.
Gun owners in a household (predominantly men) are more likely to report that their gun is stored unlocked and loaded, compared to the non-owners (predominantly women) in those households. This argues for better education of household members regarding safe storage in homes with children.
Gun Violence Facts: Assault-style Weapons
These weapons are responsible for a minority of gun deaths in the US, but have become the weapon of choice for the assailant whose intent is chaos and casualties.
In an April 2018 review of mass shootings in the U.S., 99 mass shootings have occurred since 1982, from which approximately 76 semi-automatic handguns and 89 assault weapons and weapons with high magazine capacity were recovered.
On May 18, 2018, a teen shooter used a shotgun and a .38-caliber revolver that he took from his father to kill 10 people and wound 10 others at Santa Fe High School in Texas; this marked the 1,686th mass shooting since Sandy Hook Elementary School in December 2012.
In 2017 alone, 11 mass shootings in the US caused 117 fatalities and 587 injuries occurring in concert, religious, workplace, airport, and shopping venues and in the community.
At Sandy Hook Elementary School in Newtown, Conn. in 2012, Adam Lanza reportedly fired more than 150 shots in less than five minutes from his assault-style rifle with a high capacity magazine.
On June 12, 2016 at Pulse Nightclub, a single shooter killed 49 people and injured 53. It was the worst mass shooting in US history until the mass shooting in Las Vegas in October 2017 took 58 lives and left 546 injured.
In February 2018, a school shooting at Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School in Parkland, FL left 17 people dead and 14 wounded. The teen shooter used an AR-15 semi-automatic style weapon, the same weapon used during the 2012 shooting at Sandy Hook Elementary School.
States that restrict assault weapons also have the lowest per capita homicide rates. However, because guns are easily trafficked in interstate and international commerce, federal rules are needed.
Researchers from Harvard School of Public Health demonstrated that from 1982 to 2011, mass shootings occurred every 200 days on average. From late 2011 to 214, they found mass shootings had occurred at triple that rate—every 64 days on average.
Gun Injury Prevention Research
Federal legislation passed in 1997 stated that “none of the funds made available for injury prevention and control at the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) may be used to advocate or promote gun control.” The vague nature of this law, and its 2011 extension to the National Institutes of Health, has effectively prevented federal funding for firearms-related research.
In 2013, following the Sandy Hook shooting, former President Barack Obama issued an executive order calling for the CDC to “conduct or sponsor research into the causes of gun violence and the ways to prevent it”. Despite this and without specific appropriations from U.S. Congress, new research proposals remain unfunded.
After the federal legislation preventing firearm research, there were 25 percent fewer publications on firearms compared to what would have been expected relative to other causes of death in children.
In March 2018, a new spending bill clarified that the CDC can conduct research into gun violence but did not allocate specific funding toward this effort.
Pennsylvania-specific Gun Violence Facts
According to the CDC, there were 1,555 firearm fatalities in Pennsylvania in 2016.
In 2014 there were 1,217 firearm related injuries in Pennsylvania; almost half of these were in persons under 25 years old. Almost half (532) of all firearm related injuries in Pennsylvania occurred in Philadelphia County. The firearm mortality rate for Pennsylvania is 12 per 100,000 people, slightly higher than the national average and higher than any of our neighboring states.
In Pennsylvania, suicide and homicide accounts for over 96 percent of all firearm-related deaths according to data collected from 2010-2014.
Self-injury of Pennsylvanians by firearm is fatal 91 percent of the time, compared to hanging and poisonings which are fatal 79 percent and 3 percent of the time, respectively.
Read more about the issue and about public health approaches to gun violence on the Research in Action Blog.
Updated May 2018: There are numerous sources for the facts and statistics listed above including databases from Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, Pennsylvania Department of Health, and Mother Jones; research reports from Congressional Research Service, US General Accounting Office, Brady Campaign, and Every Town for Gun Safety; news articles from Mother Jones, Washington Post, New York Times; and many peer-reviewed journal articles. This page was reviewed by physician-scientists from the Violence Prevention Initiative."

https://injury.research.chop.edu/violence-prevention-initiative/types-violence-involving-youth/gun-violence/gun-violence-facts-and#.XMd2hxkpA0M

[Spence Tepper]

"Florida passed a Stand Your Ground law in 2005, and saw a sharp 32% increase in gun-related homicides over the 10 years to follow. 23 other states passed stand your ground laws between 2006 and 2011. Florida appears to be the most dramatic example of a relationship between Stand Your Ground and gun deaths."

https://www.safehome.org/resources/gun-laws-and-deaths/

[Spence Tepper]

If you have a gun in your home you are 2x more likely to die from homicide,
10x more likely to die of suicide....

"Data from a US mortality follow-back survey were analyzed to determine whether having a firearm in the home increases the risk of a violent death in the home and whether risk varies by storage practice, type of gun, or number of guns in the home. Those persons with guns in the home were at greater risk than those without guns in the home of dying from a homicide in the home (adjusted odds ratio = 1.9, 95% confidence interval: 1.1, 3.4). They were also at greater risk of dying from a firearm homicide, but risk varied by age and whether the person was living with others at the time of death. The risk of dying from a suicide in the home was greater for males in homes with guns than for males without guns in the home (adjusted odds ratio = 10.4, 95% confidence interval: 5.8, 18.9). Persons with guns in the home were also more likely to have died from suicide committed with a firearm than from one committed by using a different method (adjusted odds ratio = 31.1, 95% confidence interval: 19.5, 49.6). Results show that regardless of storage practice, type of gun, or number of firearms in the home, having a gun in the home was associated with an increased risk of firearm homicide and firearm suicide in the home."

https://academic.oup.com/aje/article/160/10/929/140858

[Jesse]

Doesn't help, Spencer. Those are the most vague stats of all time and all the standard chicken and egg arguments immediately pop up.

"Persons with guns in the home were also more likely to have died from suicide committed with a firearm than from one committed by using a different method (adjusted odds ratio = 31.1, 95% confidence interval: 19.5, 49.6)."

What does this even mean lol? If you had a gun, why wouldn't you use it to commit suicide being that it's the easiest and most effective method? And how would you commit suicide by gun without a gun "in the home?" This could just mean that someone went out and bought a gun that day and therefore had a gun "in the home." Retarded stuff that I can't believe passes as serious. Give me better links next time.

And I really want you to answer my question about why raw gun ownership numbers globally don't even really correspond to gun crime. It's only in America, where as I said, other factors serve as far better predictors than simple gun ownership numbers. If there's no correlation outside of one single culture, then the guns themselves obviously aren't the most useful factor to consider.

Once you look into it and get off these nonsense reports that make no sense, you're gonna convert just like you did when I showed you that your Guru wanted to slaughter African AIDS babies for profit. Believe me. Trust me.

[Sonya Bellarozzi T]

Spence,

Just curious, were you an initiate of Gurinder or Charan?

[Dungeness]

Once you look into it and get off these nonsense reports that make no sense, you're gonna convert just like you did when I showed you that your Guru wanted to slaughter African AIDS babies for profit. Believe me. Trust me.

Hm, Charan reportedly masterminded a watch smuggling
ring but, but slaughtering AIDS babies! ? Say it ain't so!

Oh, you mean GSD perhaps? Well, he's already been
convicted (or damn well should be) of heartlessly selling
a charity hospital (or did he demolish it... memory fails);
closing a school for indigent kids I think it was; making
death threats via a Michael Cohen-like thug-attorney;
and, lest we forget, various other assorted acts of
financial scumbaggery.

Makes sense he'd escalate to snuffing out the life of a
few worthless AIDS babies, eh. Call the earlier acts of
kid cruelty his gateway to pure evil,

Sorry I have to laugh a little. It helps getcha through the
tears.

[Spence Tepper]

Hi Sonya
Charan Singh
Hi Jesse
Within our society....
If you have a gun in your home you are 2x more likely to die from homicide,
10x more likely to die of suicide....

So even though gun owners think they are preventing hundreds of thousands of homocides each year, somehow or other these gun owners are twice as likely to get killed by a gun, and ten times more likely to succeed in their efforts to commit suicide.

If you have a gun in your home you're kids are more likely to die from a gun and to be injured by a gun.

It's very clear. Gun ownership is unsafe. Whatever fantasy of security people have as their excuse for keeping a gun in the home, they are less safe, less than half as safe as those who live without guns in the home. It may not be the gun. It could just be that crazy people like to own them.

[Jesse]

Safety has made us pathetic and weak people. You've made another argument in favor of guns for me if you're saying that safety will decrease with more gun ownership.

As we fight to increase gun ownership we should also ban bike helmets for kids and stop letting mothers tell boys to stop fighting until our Ned Flanders Syndrome symptoms dissipate. The current levels that have inflicted America are unsustainable.

[tucson]

Want to stop drunk drivers from killing sober drivers?

Ban sober drivers from driving.

That's how gun control works.

[Dungeness]

Want to stop drunk drivers from killing sober drivers?
Ban sober drivers from driving.
That's how gun control works.

Hm, yeah that'd work except teens still find
ways to get keys to Dad's car... and safe.

[Dustin Perkins]

A full explanation of the moment of silence is available here http://www.momentofsilence.info/