Indian guru manifests to a dead person

I got an email message from a friend recently. He keeps up on media reports of what's going on in the life of Gurinder Singh Dhillon, a.k.a. "Baba Ji," the guru of Radha Soami Satsang Beas in India.

Devotees believe that the guru appears to his disciples at the time of their death. So I appreciated the clever one line message -- which included a link to a news story.

Who says Baba ji doesn't appear when someone dies?

Comments

[EVILBUSTER]

@ brian

Almighty babaji went to the funeral of punjab chief ministers wife The CM of punjab is a personal friend of almighty babaji so i dont think its something extrodinary to harp about

[Blogger Brian]

I'm not harping about it. I'm just passing on a message that contained a clever allusion to the guru's supposed ability to manifest in his "radiant form" at the moment of death.

[EVILBUSTER]

@ BRIAN

i know you are the same person who wrote LIFE IS FAIR and this book changed many peoples lives even bollywood celebrities like kareena kapoor who was a hardcore non vegitarian became a hardcore vegitarian after reading your book

so i wanted to ask wat has made u hostile towards our RSSB and y have u started this blog to criticise our RSSB

I also want to add that majority people criticizing our RSSB are not initiates like TAO,ROGERS etc so their words are futile as they dont know anything and just bark for the sake of barking solely dependant on word of mouth and internet

As far as almighty babaji is concerned im a dirty mortal to even utter a word in his praise so i just wanted to say y ru criticising him by saying he has changed santmat,religare insider trading,religare shares etc wen u know that each of the points u have raised to criticise the almighty are wrong or have no base to be called wrong

As far as all the bullshit santmat has changed and all the blah blah which happens over here by the people like ROGERS,TAO,MARINA,ROBBINS,TARA, who try to prove a satsangi wrong by forcing their point to change the mindset of any RSSB intiates i think has no impact

I will like to clarify that RSSB/SM has not changed whether u like it or not ROBBINS sys that he has heard in satsang that things have changed But BRIAN i an asure u that living in INDIA and hearing more satsang than the combine strenght of the people present over here i will say the man u say gurinder and criticise him is indeed GOD whether u like it or not it cannot be changed atleast by dirty mortals like us

I would also like to ask y have u left RSSB?

[Blogger Brian]

Wow, cool! How do you know Kareena Kapoor became a vegetarian after reading my book? I'm curious if there is any info about this on the Internet, given that she is called "the world's sexiest vegetarian." (Funny, I thought I was.)

As to leaving RSSB, supposedly this is impossible, since the guru's initiation means that I will be reborn again under more favorable circumstances (less skeptical genes, I guess) and find another guru to continue on with.

However, I don't attend satsang anymore. I do meditate every morning in my own fashion, but only for 20-30 minutes. Which is, though, longer than a lot of RSSB initiates do, I suspect. I continue to search for the truth, so in that sense I'm still a satsangi ("sat" means truth).

[Dogribb]

I started eating KFC,Good Times and Long John Silver's soon after reading Brian's blog.Matter of fact I just finished a Corn Dog :P

[EVILBUSTER]

@ BRIAN

KAREENA KAPOOR is the ex gf of SHAHID KAPOOR who is the son of PANKAJ KAPOOR and one day shaid gave LIFE IS FAIR to kareena which changed kareenas life

In an interview KARRENA has admitted reading LIF

[Marina]

Is there anyone here on this blog who is looking to realise the truth or are we more interested in realising how right we are, how wrong others are?

Are we into defending our beliefs and condeming others for theirs?

Are we more interested in getting 'facts' about others then finding out 'facts' about ourselves?

Are we so much enjoying the 'dramas' that we don't care about the truth, the real truth about ourselves and realising that?

Just wondering........

[Mungos]

Marina with all respect but you should ask that questions to yourself.What, do you want for all of us to say Yes and than you will take us to the promised land? Be open and honest if you want to say to Brian to stop bloging than say that straight.But guess what bloging will not stop, guessing will not stop, critic will not stop,..why? cause everything is a part of human life.

[Marina]

Well Mungos, if you read my post, I did say 'we' and not 'you', so I am asking myself them questions.

I don't want you to say or do anything you don't want, and I certainly don't want to 'take' anybody anywhere - too busy with myself.

As for being honest, if I wanted to tell Brian to stop blogging :))),I would have asked him to stop, believe you me.

In fact Mungoes, I have recently sent a comment to Brian telling him what I thought of his site - if you want to see it, check out "The Ultimte Truth" thread.

Though I don't agree with everything on the blog, (ha who does) I am willing to live and let live.

Roll on bloggers!!!!

Marina

[Mungos]

You said we and that include others too.You were talking like teacher or nlp coach trainer in a class .. should we, yes lets. style.
But i am glad you are changing that now.

[Marina]

Well others don't have to include you - make up your own mind and you take it the way you want.........

Why should it make you glad if I am changing or not? Does what I do really affect you? Just a question for yourself, don't bother answering for me.

[Mungos]

Again you are forcing me to ask myself. And all i politely asked you to leave us out from asking ourselves. When someone ask you to not force him you go and do that again. Come on

[Mungos]

And Marina i did not say i am glad that you are changing i said i am glad that you changed the question from Are we, are we to am I.I was glad that you are asking yourself again and not us.Is that really too much for you to accept cause you came back with force on me.

[Marina]

Why are you speaking for 'us'?

Same difference Mungos.

[tAo]

Marina,

"realizing the truth" is easy. it's always right in front of you. you just have to open your eyes and look. and it won't be found in spiritual or mystical mumbo-jumbo.

[Betty]

I do not know most appropriate place to offer this link to article on kids in Punjab going blind due to contaminated drinking water.

http://indiatoday.intoday.in/site/story/kids-in-punjab-villages-losing-sight-to-polluted-drinking-water/1/109164.html

When I was at the Dera last they were showing well-made, short public announcement film encouraging organ donation (after death, of course), esp. eyes. Now I understand why.

Also somewhere Tara mentioned that RSSB/Dera did not address the problem of abortion of female fetuses in India which has lead to too many boys and not enough girls. Actually RSSB DID address it and have published a book called --- Empowering Women.

Thanks, Betty

[Mungos]

Yo Marina gosh you are sexy!Hrrrrrrrr.rrrr.rr..

[Marina]

Yo Mungoes you are funny! Ha ha ha lol lol lol.

By the way Mungoes, how do you define 'sexy'?

Is it in how they look, how they act, what they are wearing, what they are saying.....???

Maybe you better not answer that..... that's another story!!!

Marina ;)

[Marina]

PS Is it in spelling your name wrong 'Mongoes' :)))

[Marina]

Well tAo,

it is nice to see you back conversing with me. I thought you feel out with me.... lol

Marina

[Mungos]

Marina Mariny Marinadae i am just sending you pure love and peace and respect and that can be sexy too in purest way! Love

[Robert Searle]

One is reminded here about the Deathbed Visions of Karlis Osis who claimed that reports of people dying saw the "Gods" of their own religion intending to take them away. So, there is no reason not to believe that Gurinder will appear at a persons passing. Ofcourse, whether this is mental projection of sorts, or a manifestation of ones guide, or oven ones Higher Self is another matter. Personally, I tend to believe Faqir Chand that the Real Guru is ones Higher Self, and that even an imperfect guru (arguably Gurinder) can act as a spiritual link to the "Highest Power." Thus, the inner Gurinder for initiates may in many, or most cases be their Real Selves which are a part of God...

[David]

According to Mike Williams, pranahuti gurus can transmit paranormal experiences to others. Therefore the idea that the guru coming at death is simply the "higher self" doesn't seem as compelling in these instances.

However, from a higher perspective, everything that exists is your higher self. You might want to call it God playing with itself through all of us. We seem to have some kind of seperate egoic existence from the universe but this is an illusion, just like when we wake from dreams we realise that the dream was unreal. In the same sense, waking reality is unreal from the perspective of the dream consciousness. Taken altogether, it is just one big consciousness manifesting as absolutely everything and interacting with itself in these seemingly delusive dream like ways.

So the master coming at death could well be the higher self. But as far as you are i are concerned, none of this has any real meaning.

[Betty]

Tara

I agree that public announcements and books are not the same as helping to finance a solution, hands-on involvement.

Guess it is OK to purchase parcels of Terra Firma, with $$$, but beyond their scope to help prevent and clean up the mess that we are making here on Mother Earth. Let us see how long these Sant Mat preachers of the Higher Worlds last when Mother Earth can no longer provide ozone, oxygen, food, water, and reproductive abilities to the "spiritual" human species. Dumber than a sack of hammers.

(Did you ever watch the English movie "Children of Man"?)

[Marina]

I feel to expect anyone from 'religous/spiritual' leaders, to politicians to anyone, to be able to clean up the 'mess' here on mother earth that we all have created in some whay or other can never be. Yes, we can all do our bit. And we all have our responsibility for creating it. That does not mean we can't lobby and do our best. To me though, it all starts with ourselves. How can we force anyone to do anything? We have to clean up our own 'mess' first.

But lets say you get rid of ALL leaders. What would happen next? Who knows. It may end up like the book/film, Lord of the Flies.

Marina

[Nietzsche]

Children of Men is great! If I remember well it gave me a feeling that this all might be happening tomorrow.

One remark to some others. You tried to define 'sexy' and you didn't succeed. The meaning of sexy is not programmed in your brain with definitions. It is simply shown ;) (Wittgenstein :))
Now show me the meaning of 'the truth' and I will follow it. Or is it just in front of you all the time like tAo said with no relation to spiritual mumbo jumbo ;)

[Mungos]

Yes we did succeed but maybe not to you.

[Marina]

I second that, yes we did succeed in defining the word sexy - to our standards anyway... maybe Wittgenstein had his standards but I am not him.

PS. Don't let anyone show you the 'truth' - find/realise it for yourself. Yes, other people may give you pointers but realise it for yourself and then and only then will it be real! :))

[Catherine]

Robert, how would you see a sant mat guru freeing as opposed to stifling a person. The reason only very few santmat initiates openly express themselves on this blog, for instance, is because the rest are superstitious, afraid of losing and hopeful agsinst all reason and odds.

Otherwise, I agree with you!

[Betty]

Found this photo and short poem, and the last 3 lines are, I think, insightful.

We have, without a doubt, annexed Sky from Earth, Nature from Soul, disembodied riders in our own heads looking for.......

anyhow,

http://adeeyoyo.wordpress.com/2010/11/11/an-apology-to-mother-earth/

Betty

p.s. Yes, I much appreciated the movie Children of Men too

[Marina]

Well Tara,

You asked me if I tend to over think things a little bit. I don’t think so, but you obviously do :)) and that is fine with me.

That reminds me of my mother who passed just over a year ago, she use to say to me "Marina' you dig too deep. Don't rock the boat!" My reply back was "Mam, I will rock the boat as hard as it needs to be rocked and if it overturns, so be it." (Stubborn to the hilt I can be)

For me thinking/questioning/enquiring are important. Is that not what we all are doing?

Being honest with you, I don’t want to be part of another ‘club’ that is at odds with any other group or feeling special for being on the blog. If it was from that point of view, I don’t see the difference in one ‘club’ thinking they are special and another ‘club’ thinking they are special in another way. Same difference. That was where I was coming from when I asked Brian those questions for myself.

I just don’t want to make Brian into a Guru blog daddy. I wouldn’t be able to relate to him from there, or as an equal. In a way I see Brian and the blog along with all the bloggers as equally important. One cannot exist without the other. What good could Brian do if he was left writing to himself? ;)

Marina

[Marina]

Catherine,

I like your point "The reason only very few santmat initiates openly express themselves on this blog, for instance, is because the rest are superstitious, afraid of losing and hopeful agsinst all reason and odds

That is so true for me anyway. I did have times when I had thoughts of losing something (grace) or being afraid I was going astray. But the main thing I kept coming back to was, the truth. Go find out Marina what is true for you and what are just beliefs. Still working on it as you can probably tell :)

I am still cautious about telling a couple of my RS friends who I don't see that often as I don't socialise in RS.

The reason being, one, they will (or I assume they will) tell me it is kal and two, I don't like to mess with other peoples beliefs if they are happy with what they are doing. In saying that, I would tell them if they asked me, I wouldn't lie but I would only give them information as they asked for it and wouldn't push anything on them.

Marina

[Marina]

Sorry Tara,

My reply to you was meant for the thread on "One Million Page Views..."

But I am sure you will get it none the less.

Marina

[Nietzsche]

If you are afraid to disturbing someones happiness you should leave all junks alone. I think that there are more important goals. If my child was simply wanting to be happy and in the process she would throw here future away I would disturb her happiness!

[Nietzsche]

Mungos wrote 'we did succeed but maybe not to you' :)

I take this opportunity to go a little further. You succeeded in understanding Marina about 'sexiness' because in the past someone has shown you that meaning. You would not have understood it if you had never seen a beautiful woman ;)

But 'the truth' has never been shown to you. Some had mystical experiences but do they label them the truth? Plato told about the truth as an idea that was somehow shining through in our language. In other words, 'the truth' by Plato was a concept. No one has seen it but it was defined as a philosophical explanation for what we see.
Now if Gurinder says we are full of concepts than he himself has at least one concept too. 'The One' is another concept in my opinion.
Leaving these concepts away makes the language much clearer. In stead of saying 'seek the truth'. He should just say 'sit and meditate'. He didn't mean seek the book from Plato and read it.
That is why I call 'the truth' mumbo jumbo. Plato however had a beautiful story about it but his explanation seems unlikely now that we know after Wittgenstein how language in fact was formed. But in poetry 'the truth' is still a beautiful word with a lot of feeling. Perhaps we should regard Gurinder as a poet ? :)

[Marina]

Yes Tara,

I came up with the questions which I am happy with. You are you and I am I.

I have no problem giving someone praise if it feels fitting for me and I'll do it again to show you.....Brian, a big hearty handshake and a big, big bear hug. Oh and Brian if you do happen to want more or would like it a differnt way....please let me know;)

I'm not into 'standards' Tara but thanks for the 'advice' for enquiring into the "blog master" whoever that is?????

Real world???? Blog master????

I wasn't asking your advice on 'congratulations', my question was for Brian specifically....

Marina ;)

[Marina]

Do you know what is right for you? Yes maybe. But to say you would disturb your childrens happiness - what do you mean by that?

[Mungos]

Nietzsche i am sorry but you complicated my 'sexy' way too much. Some things are simple and my was kind of that. I don't want to bother you too much with that cause it was a compliment to break the tension from my side nothing more. Peace

[Nietzsche]

Nothing specific, haven't thought about it that far. Don't take it personal ;)

[Marina]

Sometimes Nietzsche it is hard not to (take things personal)

If I have already gone there and a bit later I may say to myself oops, I did it again...;) Though I don't think people take me serious anyway.....so no big deal.

To do it again and again, until I don't...

[Nietzsche]

Mungos, I see I'm going to far with this sort of joke ;) When I reread it I get the feeling that Marina describes so clearly and often...wish I could write like Brian ;)

[Mungos]

For me you write great as Nietzche or the man behind him. Peace

[sapient]

btw recently i read that after breaking up with her hard core vegetarian satsangi friend Shahid, Kareena is not a vegetarian anymore :):)

[SM]

PROOF that Swami Shiv Dayal Singh Ji (Swami Ji) never had a guru so became self made, smoked 'hooka' and became a Ghost!!!! Written by his very own brother, Partap Singh Ji.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v​=MXnnGxEILoM&feature=autoplay&​list=ULEglG8UB4Pgg&index=531&p​laynext=2

[Marina]

No offence SM, rather than going into what I thought of the link you posted and saying WTF, such BS, I found this cartoon from Jeffrey Hill that shows the history of communication when we all hold onto our own viewpoint - nothing changes. Around and around in cirles we go. Same shit, different means of communicating it. :)

http://jeffreyhill.typepad.com/english/2009/04/cartoon-history-of-communcation.html

Marina

[the specialist]

For Brian...Kareena Kapoor broke up with Shahid a while back and has long been dating another dude (these celebrities don't do committment very well you see)and has since started eating meat again ;)
Question: Is Life is Fair the equivalent to having the tattoo of an ex-girlfriend on your body that is too expensive to erase? I read many comments from satsangi's who are fans of that particular book and are astounded that you have (in my opinion)evolved into a real seeker of truth. It must be irritating being cross referenced against your own work is it not?

[Blogger Brian]

the specialist, I like attention. I'm not bothered by how people speak of me, just so long as they do! There will be plenty of time for me to be ignored after I'm dead. Might as well suck up attention now, while I can.

[Baldeep]

Hi All,

I don't know about Karina or Shid, I only know about RSSB Chief Gurinder , as I have personal experience and I asked few questions to him, but the answeres were really rubbish and people are just brain washed and don't want to see reality while this is so called guru is gatering all material assets, his sons finished study in UK in top collegs where ordinary student had to pay a big study loan after degree his sons had millions of dollers in the bank and shares in many companies. He spen million of dollers in his son's wedding in Gurgaon in a Farm House....and he also justified in answer that these days kids wants big weddings so what parents can do.....so not a role model for parents.......I spent few years to attend his so called sat sang while there was no sat in them...only using saints teaching as a business resources

[Gaz]

Gurinder has worked hard, so you're no one to judge, you can't question if he sent his kids to the highest Universities in the UK.

[Juan]

Don Gurinder has not only worked hard, but is still working very hard,no one can judge him,it is his hard earned money and it is upto him whether he donates the money to his kids or sends them to highest universities.

[Gaz]

Juan, you're probably aware of Kamal, Baba Ji's right hand man, he told a story a few weeks ago. Him and Baba Ji went to a store in the UK, they went to shop for sandals, Kamal picked up sandals that were worth £90, Baba Ji said take them back, and instead bought sandals that were priced £2.99.

So people questionning where Baba Ji's spend his money, should think again.

Btw Juan, if you don't mind me asking, which country are you from? Sounds like you're from Spain.

[Juan]

Gaz, I don´t know who is Kamal, anyway he has revealed the secret how Babaji has been saving small amounts which have gradually turned out in billions.

I personally have no questions where he spends his money, it is his hard earned money, he can do whatever he wishes.

You r right, I am from Spain.

[Guv]

I read Mungos comments

Gurinder himself said " We are a spiritual organization, not a charitable one. "

If it is correct then why Gurinder took thousands of hectares land from UK govt on the name of Charity and his organisation is registered as a Charity organisation in UK

He travel in Business class in all over the world, both son UK settled had millions of dollars in shares and they are in their 20s..I know personally how this cult is making fool people

[Guv]

This Gurinder spent many carores of indian rupees on his eldest son wedding in Delhi on a farm house when someone asked this question in one of his so called Satsang he made excuse that we had to do it for kids...what a Guru this is Guru Nanak didn't care about his kids when doing social service....he could have given hundreds of children a good life with that money...there are many examples I can share..he used his people to acquired Govt land in one night and many are witness of this even they built a big wall and painted it all have done in one black night not in day time....In Mussoorie they made illegally his Holiday home..local Municipal corporation was really good they were not corrupt and they knocked it down..will the real Guru will do things illegally????

[Paul]

Guv,

Welcome to the forum, could you tell us a bit about yourself? Where are you based? And how long were you following RS for?

Thanks

Paul

[the9thGate]

Has anybody seen the film Flatliners starring Keifer Sutherland and Kevin Bacon? If we could repeat that experiment performed in that film then maybe we could test out the "seeing the Guru after death" theory. On a similar tangent....has anybody actually seen "the radiant" form? Brian; you've meditated for years as have others on this site...surely a radiant glimpse would have appeared for somebody that holds some credibility and could testify to seeing it.

[Robert Searle]

Whether Babaji appears, or not to a dead person is immaterial. It could be a trick of the mind...or it could be a low spirit entity masquerading as Babaji.....or it could be the manifestation of the Higher Self appearing in the guise of Babaji due to a Satsangis faith...In other words, to use the American expression. It is no big deal!!

[777]

About appearances

At the death of my mother in law
my wife saw her satguru Charan
standing at the head side
and in a special light--way
It was before Charan left us

he was as it were much bigger than the height of the room
as if the ceiling was transparent and he had his arms / hands
around the body of the dying
mother in a kind of protecting way.

It took of course away all sense of grief from my wife
Her grief changed into jubilation
up to today

I was not there.

I like to emphasize that normally Saints
appear much earlier than at the time of death
which I would call 'last res-sort'

Not only proper initiated see their beloved at all times, included meditation

but through the Dhyan you see on which Saint your SatGuru Himself is absorbed in

and then in this our case you see where Sawan Singh Ji is absorbed in

and then
where Jaimal goes, Seth Shiv up to TULSI sahib, etc

and then a bunch of very Holy Guys
you don't know
but it is like a tunnel
full of happy , very excited and humoristic Jivas

which I believe is the community of the Saints, - going straight to the Source
and
we are invited to join

There are xillions of those centripetal tunnels
and it never ends because of the Fibonacci spiral rule

777

[Juan]

About appearances
At the death of my mother in law my wife saw her satguru Charan standing at the head side and in a special light—way It was before Charan left us he was as it were much bigger than the height of the room as if the ceiling was transparent and he had his arms / hands around the body of the dying mother in a kind of protecting way.
These Masters are True Sant Satgurus and omnipresent, they take care of the soul of their disciples, but the only condition is that you have to be a REAL GURMUKH.