« “From Taoist to Infidel” – sounds like me | Main | Desiring God isn’t a proof of God »

June 30, 2008

Comments

Feed You can follow this conversation by subscribing to the comment feed for this post.

"Oh," said the elderly priest with a benevolent smile, "those are such secondary matters."

that was excellent!! and people wonder why i laugh at there rules. there definition of God i mean come on. if there is such a being he has no concerns with us. lets say enough to condemn one forever.. so my definition differs. i do believe there is another being one from which we are all a piece of. and our reward after a mere glimpse of The Way is returning to the source. endless life concedes with endless choice.

"Atheist spirituality"...this very morning I have been reading the Dalai Lama's understanding of religion versus spirituality. To quote his book "Ancient Wisdom, Modern World" (p22-23):

*Religion I take to be concerned with belief in the claims to salvation of one faith tradition or another...Connected with this are religious teachings or dogma...Spirituality I take to be concerned with those qualities of the human spirit-such as love and compassion...which bring happiness to self and others. Whilst ritual and prayer, along with questions of nirvana...are directly connected with religious faith, these inner qualities need not be, however. There is no reason why the individual should not develop them, even to a high degree, without recourse to any religious or metaphysical belief system.*

Or to sum it up, religion is about belief, spirituality is about actions.

Long live your coffee house spirituality Brian.

and to LOOSELY quote another, perhaps more controversial authority given the readership of this blog,

the current RSSB master, in Spain, recently said,

"Sant Mat is not about a brand...the important question is, what is he doing, what action is he taking, to move towards his goal"

when asked by someone if a certain gentleman who had been initiated by a certain other guru could and should be reinitiated by the current RSSB master.

Helen,

You quoted the Dalai Lama,

"Spirituality I take to be concerned with those qualities of the human spirit-such as love and compassion...which bring happiness to self and others."

---Is it possible that there is a thin line between some Religions and Spirituality? Love and Compassion are wonderful human actions. I think, I can find those actions in play at the Church down the street and two city blocks thereafter.
---Are you aware of any other Spiritual actions that are available and not so well known?
Thanks,
Roger

Hello Roger

*Is it possible that there is a thin line between some Religions and Spirituality?*

or none at all or a vast gulf. I guess it depends on who you are talking about Roger: not being acquainted with your church I cannot comment, but I'm quite happy to accept your own assessment of it.

*Love and Compassion are wonderful human actions. I think, I can find those actions in play at the Church down the street and two city blocks thereafter.*

Good for you. They can also be found in your average drug dealers den, in wife-beaters and peodophiles, and apparently some Nazi concentration camp commandants were wonderful husbands and fathers. When in the 80's Sting wrote the song "Do Russians Love their Children Too" the answer is "yes, of course they do". Even the criminally insane can feel and act in love and compassion. Ergo, ethical action is not exclusive to the religious; the exclusion lies in religious truth claims.

*Are you aware of any other Spiritual actions that are available and not so well known?*

Are you talking in terms of a specific tradition Roger? The book by the Dalai Lama is attempting to define a universal spiritual ethic. I'm not certain that any religious tradition would have matching ethics with another tradition or they would be the same tradition.

If however you are asking about my own personal ethics then I would say that I doubt I could possibly contribute anything new or previously unthought of in certain religious traditions or in secular humanism.

Helen,

I don't belong to any religious tradition. My questions that I posed to you are really no big deal. Hopefully, just some interesting conversation. Nothing more.
However, as far as the word, Spirituality, is concerned. Is there an action that One can absolutely classify as Spiritual? I think, a part of your reply shows that (Love and Compassion) human actions can be catalogued into many different
groups. Spirituality sounds like a really nice word. Again, No Big Deal.
Best wishes...Roger

I find your "No Big Deal" in all caps to be quite ironic Roger.

hello Roger.

*My questions that I posed to you are really no big deal. Hopefully, just some interesting conversation. Nothing more.*

I never said they were a big deal Roger, I simply answered as I saw fit. As for being interesting, are you complaining that I'm boring you??? lol.

*Is there an action that One can absolutely classify as Spiritual?*

What do you think Roger?

*I think, a part of your reply shows that (Love and Compassion) human actions can be catalogued into many different
groups.*

Do you mean groups of people or groups of behaviours? Which part of my reply?

Hi,

I have read your blog and agree with you about the various disciplines in a spiritual belief system . I dont think getting up at 3 am and going to satsangg everyday are compulsary in order to follow the faith of RSSB. These things are supposed to be what the teachings say are good for you. Noones saying that you will go to hell or something if u dont do these. About the excessive stress on the guru, that is something I dont know about. I am a believer too. However, I would rather think that the guru was a medium for me to connect with god. Guru as god, is subtle. It is believed that at teh spiritual level, we are all 'atman' or in spirit we are all part of God. A droplet of the Infiniteness. Guru is somebody who has realized it. At the ground level, spirituality is all about knowing Oneself...its about 'atma-gyan' in hindi which means knowledge of self. By knowing ourselves , that is by knowing who we are truly we understand god. If peopel take the guru is god thing too dogmatically that shoudlnt reflect badly on the system. At a spiritual level, all masters are one....and not only masters, every human being is the same 'atman', so its not a surprise if master charan singh says that all masters are same. He isnt glorifying himself but everyone. However, I would also liek to congratulate you on your rational and clear outlook. You appear to me to still be a true searcher , an expplorer who liek me is also looking for answers. If you can, please email me your response. My email shoudl reach you thhrough this comment. Thanks and please do email, I hope to discuss with you about these matters more. By the way, am a 17 yrs old, student from India.

Helen,

Thanks for your reply. I appreciate your answers to my many questions. You seem very honest and sincere. Feel free to write additional comments on what 'Spirituality' means.
Thanks again...Roger

Brian,

.....rather elderly man who introduced himself as a Catholic priest......

--The elderly Catholic priest, sounds like a wonderful person to invite to a coffeehouse conversation. Letting him discuss his many years of exposure. Listening to his views on a number of topics, such as, "those are such secondary matters." Not to ask so many questions, just to sit back and listen. WOW, what fun that would be.

Hey,
Can someone send me the contact information of Radha Saomi Satsang Beas in Canada.
Its kinda urgent.
Thnx...

Verify your Comment

Previewing your Comment

This is only a preview. Your comment has not yet been posted.

Working...
Your comment could not be posted. Error type:
Your comment has been saved. Comments are moderated and will not appear until approved by the author. Post another comment

The letters and numbers you entered did not match the image. Please try again.

As a final step before posting your comment, enter the letters and numbers you see in the image below. This prevents automated programs from posting comments.

Having trouble reading this image? View an alternate.

Working...

Post a comment

Comments are moderated, and will not appear until the author has approved them.

Your Information

(Name is required. Email address will not be displayed with the comment.)

Welcome


  • Welcome to the Church of the Churchless. If this is your first visit, click on "About this site--start here" in the Categories section below.
  • HinesSight
    Visit my other weblog, HinesSight, for a broader view of what's happening in the world of your Church unpastor, his wife, and dog.
  • BrianHines.com
    Take a look at my web site, which contains information about a subject of great interest to me: me.
  • Twitter with me
    Join Twitter and follow my tweets about whatever.
  • I Hate Church of the Churchless
    Can't stand this blog? Believe the guy behind it is an idiot? Rant away on our anti-site.