Religious questioning is natural

Like most bloggers, I love getting email. Making connections with like-minded (or unlike-minded) people from anywhere in the world is a wonderful reward for the time and effort that goes into a weblog.

Recently I got a message from another member of the spiritual group, Radha Soami Satsang Beas (RSSB), that I’ve been involved with for thirty-five years. This is how my correspondent ended his email:

I do not know whether you will feel the following questions too personal to answer, but if you do not mind , will you mind answering them?: Are you or were you ever a satsangi? What is your spiritual philosophy these days? Can you comment at all on the Sant Mat Gurus, especially Maharaj Gurinder Singh? How do you recommend one seeks the Ultimate Truth?

By “satsangi” he meant specifically an initiate of the mystical path known variously as Sant Mat, Radha Soami Satsang Beas, Science of the Soul, Surat Shabd Yoga, or Radha Soami. Satsangi is a generic word that literally means “one who associates with truth (sat).” Since many spiritual groups in India and elsewhere consider that they are on the path to knowing truth, you can be a “satsangi” of various denominations—to use a rather ill-fitting Christian term. “Satsang” is a meeting of satsangis, a service if you will.

I was asked good questions, some obviously much easier to answer than others. Though personal, I didn’t mind making a stab at answering them and have shared my response below. I realize my language will seem foreign to many people. But substitute, for example, “Pope” for “Master” and “Catholic Church” for “Radha Soami Satsang Beas” if my message seems too distant from your own experience.

My basic point is universal: after you’ve belonged to a religious or spiritual organization for more than a few years, it’s natural to be more critical of it. The more knowledgeable you become about a church, faith, philosophy, or theology, the more flaws you’ll find.

The ultimate reality we call “God” can’t be confined within any manmade system. Religions try to put bounds around boundlessness, but this is a futile exercise. Truth always finds a way to express itself. So I encourage people to trust their direct experience over abstract concepts.

When something seems wrong about the spiritual path you’re following, likely it is. If it appears that you can drop some inessential ritualistic practice, almost certainly you should. Keep what works for you; discard what doesn’t.

Here’s my mildly edited response to the questions I was asked:

Dear ________:

I am indeed a Sant Mat (RSSB) initiate, dating way back from the class of 1971. I now am inclined to shy away from labels such as “satsangi.” My wife is a non-initiate and I have found that this satsangi/non-satsangi distinction is unproductive, just as the Christian/non-Christian distinction is.

Sometimes a satsangi will phone us; my wife answers and hears the greeting, “Radha soami.” She then says, “Hello.” The caller again says, “Radha soami.” She refuses to go further with the conversation until the person communicates like a normal human being rather than a cult member.

I’ve become a bit of a Sant Mat “heretic,” just as you seem to be. Maybe more than “a bit of” in fact. My quest these days is to discern the essential in spirituality. The rest seems to be in the realm of religion, not mysticism or what I like to call spiritual science. There is a lot of religiosity in RSSB even though this path supposedly isn’t a religion. When blind belief and faith are elevated over direct experience and questioning, I call that a religion.

I still feel a lot of fondness for RSSB/Sant Mat and continue to attend satsang most Sundays. But I’ll admit that I go more for the socializing than for the satsang. Our post-satsang coffee shop conversations go on for considerably longer, and with considerably more enthusiasm, than the 45 minute satsang.

My spiritual philosophy keeps evolving in the direction of Advaita and non-religious Buddhism, assuming those terms really mean anything, which I suspect they don’t. Immersing myself in the teachings of the Greek philosopher Plotinus exacerbated my existing tendencies in that direction. I think you would enjoy my book “Return to the One,” though since I’m the author, I’m obviously horribly biased. Plotinus’ philosophy is remarkably close to that of Sant Mat, with the notable exception of not mentioning the need for a living “guru.” Or, for that matter, a dead guru.

I’ve been reading several books by Steven Hagen, who I like a lot. His “Buddhism Plain and Simple” reverberates with me, as does “Buddhism is Not What You Think: Finding Freedom Beyond Beliefs.” I don’t agree with everything Hagen says, but I very much appreciate his attempt to get beyond the religiosity of Buddhism and reach the essential core, which he says is simply seeing.

I empathize with your frustration with Sant Mat meditation, and RSSB in general. We’re different people, so my experience may have no relevance to your own. All I can say is that I’ve been energized by taking a fresh look at what seems to work for me in meditation, and what doesn’t, regardless of whether it is 100% Sant Mat certified. The goal in Sant Mat meditation, after all, is to do nothing. No mantra, no visualization. Just being there as soul, pure consciousness, and experiencing whatever is there.

This is perfectly compatible with Hagen’s plain and simple Buddhism, and also with Ramana’s plain and simple Advaita. Ramana is another teacher whom I’ve enjoyed reading, finding in him the core of mystic practice without the distractions of complex concepts and suppositions.

Re. Master Gurinder Singh, since I don’t know who I am, I certainly would make no claim to understanding anyone else. Only Master Gurinder Singh knows who Master Gurinder Singh is. Since he doesn’t make any claims of godliness for himself, one can either surmise (1) that he is a humble god-man, or (2) that he isn’t a god-man. In my opinion, it doesn’t matter which is true. It’s my own experience that I’m concerned about, not the Master’s.

That is, my current approach to spirituality is basically this: I’ll do my best to meditate and discover what lies beyond appearances. I believe that if the cosmos is One, and I’m part of it, that whatever the essence of me is, also is the essence of the cosmos. Wherever this journey leads, I’ll believe in what I see and experience directly. Everything else is just a hypothesis: Guru is God, spirit creates and sustains the universe, soul can unite with spirit, and so on.

I muse about this stuff on my Church of the Churchless weblog. I haven’t arrived at any real answers yet, but I’m enjoying the questioning. Trust yourself. If I have faith in anything, it is that the Truth with a capital “T” is able to burst through any and all barriers, and it makes its presence known in all sorts of highly individualistic ways.

My guess is that you already know what spiritual path attracts you, and you are just looking for validation. I could be wrong, but I do this all the time myself, so the process is familiar to me. I look for books and people to affirm what I already am quite sure of, deep down. If I didn’t already know what I was looking for, I wouldn’t be attracted to it when I saw it.

Warm greetings, Brian

Comments

[Jeffrey]

Brian

I enjoyed reading your reply regarding the Radhasoami Path. Is it very significant that I came to this web-site whilst browsing. I was thinking about RSSB initiation and I 've had to tthink long and hard, do research, look for supporting information. H

Have people experienced Nam after several years? I have not met any yet! They are around I guess?

It is appealing, but it is about validation.

Any suggestions?

Jeffrey.

[Peter R Dudfield]

Hi Brian,
Greetings from New Zealand.
Like yourself I'm an initiate of Maharaji dating back to 1973 and have had exposure to other approaches to spirituality, namely Rinzai Zen under Joshu Sasaki Roshi for some years in the 80's and several Vipassana teachers and an association with a Chan (chinese zen) monk in the the 90's. I visited Dera once for 2 weeks in the 70's with my wife Dianne who had just received Nam and I didn't return until November last year although Dianne visited once during the interum period.
I read your book "God's Whisper" a few years back and have yet to read your latest although a Satsangi friend of mine in Tauranga,was busy translating it into German
recently.
Even after our recent trip to India when we visited the Buddhist sites at Ajunta in Maharasthra before proceeding up thru Rajasthan to Beas I feel more at ease with Chan Buddhism as presented by Master Sheng-Yeng (refer "Illuminating Silence" edited by John Crook) and the almost Taost teachings conveyed in "The Secret of the Golden Flower" as translated by Cleary, than anything else. Josh Baran's "365 Nirvana" is also a helpful touchstone for the non religious approach.
It is good to touch base with someone who has simillar feelings to ones own on this subject if only in order to know other folk also hold to a different approach and that it isn't just a personal heresy. Thank you so much for creating this forum.
Wishing you all the very best,
Peter Dudfield

[daniel from romania]

We are serching for the same and that´s the very problem... that "WE" are serching....Whether found a truly path, or not ,makes no difference for "US" .
Need to be the path (Matrix Morpheus quote :)))), need to learn every second to dissapear...we love to live and that is incompatible with being spirit..what are we looking for? do we really know it? Then why are we still serching for?
No matter how truthfully is a path or not, is very important our sincerity, and God´s will to serch for him indeed. We have to vanish in order to be the Absolute, so are we prepared for it? Mind rejects its nonexistence , by now we are mind so do not speak about it as a third party involved in...
We love VERY much to live ,we choose paths , we let them aside...always we ,we,we... that´s the the obstacle we have to cross in every true path, if failing , do not blame the path.

Repeat in your mind for a while that all you see is irelevant, stop thinking so much, you are not important , all you see is exactly in the order god want it...and such ideas...shortly will feel like a child...you will be more prepared to practise , to think of god,

[Vera]

Radha Soami to everyone,

I am writing because I am also living in New Zealand and am trying to locate the RSSB here. Peter, can you please tell me where the RSSB is in this country? My mother is an initiate of the master before Master Gurinder Singh. My mother and I have attended satsangs together before when I was still in the Philippines. I have contacted Master Gurinder Singh before via snail mail several years ago and he said that I am not yet ready to become an initiate.

I have always been unhappy in my life, and I am, right now, seeking guidance and help. My mother said that I am feeling this way because I am being called. I do not know what to believe. My unhappiness in this world is something that is beyond my comprehension. My relationship with my friends are but superficial, my relationship with my partner is breaking down, I cannot find happiness in material pleasures and I feel that my only purpose in life is to raise my wonderful son like the way my parents raised me. I do not know where to start. I am hoping that the Master will enlighten me as to why this understand the sadness that I'm feeling. Maybe someone will be able to give me some form of guidance to free me from my woes.

I would appreciate any form of information from any of you. Please help me.

Radha Soami,

Vera

[dani]

do not believe nothing coming from outside...including your beloved mother! how is that you are called?
if you need to know where to go to satsang why dont you write down a letter to:

Radha Soami Satsang Beas
P. O. Dera Baba Jaimal singh
Dist. Amritsar 143 204, Punjab
Phone: 91-1853-72345.

now if you please could just give me the email to Gurinder! i am always on the internet...!

[Netemara]

Dear Brian,

Just happened on this blog. I think you have given good advice in your note and based upon your experience. I too questioned Sant Mat after 22 years and spent 2 full years questioning it and the path and the vows as well. I spent a great deal of time online talking to Dave Lane and his group. After starting my own group and gaining full and complete independence from Sant Mat--I went back! I am back and it is with no reservation because I questioned it and found that it is The Path with people I can relate to.

More later

Netemara

[Aman]

hi my mum in law is here in Auckland she is satsangi,is there any chace i can find out any satsang center in Auckland.Thanx

[simran]

i need babaji email add urgent. i need babaji email and phone no urgent. i need babaji email add and phone no very urgent. i know babaji never read the letter i need him personal email add if not that will be untrue and injustice and being true satsangi i need it urgent.

why letter not go the babji hand instead of sevadar who never give appropriate response and never give letter to babji how long ?
next if some problem is not reachinmg to the babji then savedar are not the wright person to give the reaponse they are not far reacher to understand the situation.they never give understand and appropiate response to any body in other sense misguided be they are not spiritual and not sens to understand the problem every letter to be reach to babji like chan singh maharaj read every letter and response. many problem in beAS regarding the letter response.
email of babaji

[Brian]

Simran, sorry. I can't help you. But take heart, you are not alone. I have heard from other people that letters to Baba Ji (Gurinder Singh Dhillon) are not delivered to him by the RSSB bureaucracy.

That is, letters seem to be screened. So if you are not on the approved list of letter writers, Baba Ji won't get your message. I agree with you: the "old days" of Charan Singh were much better in this regard. He would reply to almost every letter with great care and compassion.

[simran]

i think you are wrong you are totely wrong
you have to take action next your sevadar i will write his name he misguided one letter to one person because of that she faced very hard time the fault was you and the person who give response ok so change your why of selecting the letter mr? i will talk to bajaj uncle and complain about the sevadar . you all person those select letter are not very highly spiritual as you think soyou can give death and spoile the life i will not stop.

pl write me are you in usa or india i have to write letter india beas tell me truth i will not stop bajaj uuncle will talk with babaji now sevder are not taking wright decision, they misguided one she faced very crucial time it is shame if sevdar are not handover the leetr to babaji or it is not favour to babji to read the letter babaji should me truth full and true he has to spend some time in letter so sevdar not misguided and causes death

there is no sense of approvel in god house if he is doing that then he is not guru radasomi

he should not take the responsibility of guru call charan singh maharaj ji he was real guruadasomi as being takeing care satsangi he is ignore it is untrusty and ignoreing prop.
babji is wrong c

i need the email add of beas secreatory and bajaj ji at once

why quite

[Brian]

Simran, as I said before, I don't know those email addresses. Sorry. I've taken the liberty of combining your comments into two clumps. I sympathize with your desire to do something, but maybe there is nothing that can be done. Good luck, whatever you decide to do.

[simran]

i think you do not have approach to solve the problem i respect you but every problem have answer i do not understand what designation you in this letter babaji represented you as solved problem or ?

[Anonymous]

radhasoami,

i was just wondering if there is any place i can find out where babaji's next visit will be, or is it still by word of mouth?

also is there any website where i can get some pictures of beas property and sach khand, as well as download some shabads?

please do let me know....

radhasoami

[tao]

To Anonymous:

Others may give you some information if you are unlucky, but I would not tell you where that 'fraudulent guru' visits, even if I knew where. I would steer you as far away from him as I possibly could. Also, this site is not really the place to get such information.

Now as for pictures of Beas property, for what purpose do you desire such pictures? There are many pictures in the published photographic pictorial biographies of Sawan Singh and Jagat Singh. I don't know of any pictures on the internet.

Finally, as for pictures of "sach khand", I am literally laughing out loud at such a question!!! You obviously don't have a clue as to what "sach khand" means. Do you know anything about the path of Radha Soami or are you just a clueless websurfer? In any case, if you do find a picture of sach khand, I for one would certainly be very interested in seeing it, and I think Brian would like to see it too. Eh Brian? *wink*

[Robert Paul Howard]

Dear tao,
I admit to being a "clueless websurfer," ignorant of the path of Radha Soami. But I did stumble upon the following: www.ngfl.ac.uk/re/sachkhand.htm. I presume this term is being used in some metaphorical sense, as applied to the picture shown, but I offer it for your persual, and that of others. You may wish to comment/respond.
Robert Paul Howard

[MAMTA DADRA]

Radha Soami ji,
Myself is MAMTA DADRA. I am from Jalandhar Punjab. I want to meet BABAJI. I love BABA JI. I want NAAM Shabad but my age is 22 years. I go to dera beas every sunday for a serve from JALANDHAR PUNJAB JATHA SATNAAM SINGH JI. many peoples say me that Babaji do not give the Shabad 22 years old girls & Bachelor girls . AISA KYUN. I want Naam Shabad. Please send me any email & phone no. of BABA JI or Tell me any way to meet BABA JI. Please reply my mail as soon as possible. kya mera yeh message BABA JI tak pahuchega.Agar yes to Kab. Please Help me.
RADHA SOAMI JI

[Mamta]

Radha Soami ji,
Myself is MAMTA DADRA. I am from Jalandhar Punjab. I want to meet BABAJI. I love BABA JI. I want NAAM Shabad but my age is 22 years. I go to dera beas every sunday for a serve from JALANDHAR PUNJAB JATHA SATNAAM SINGH JI. many peoples say me that Babaji do not give the Shabad 22 years old girls & Bachelor girls . AISA KYUN. I want Naam Shabad. Please send me any email & phone no. of BABA JI or Tell me any way to meet BABA JI. Please reply my mail as soon as possible. kya mera yeh message BABA JI tak pahuchega.Agar yes to Kab. Please Help me.
RADHA SOAMI JI

[Maat Andrews]

I am glad that I have stumbled across this site. You very thoughtful to present this on the web for us seekers and question askers. I want more than anything to be a better person and to make progress spiritually, whatever that means.

I also would like to know how to make decisions. I have tried logic, intuition, and combinations. The results are never predictable, so I use as much internal guidance as possible, then accept what comes after.

I wish you all the best and will visit your site again.

[Bern]

Those of us interested in Surat Shabd Yoga may find this online TV site uplifting and inspiring. www.suprememastertv.com

[tao]

"suprememastertv" is actually Suma Ching Hai, a wanna-be glamour guru of shabda/sant mat with a large but foolish following. I wouyld not advise going that direction.

[richard]

To the girl who is looking for a satsang address in New Zealand.
Write to the rep.Tony Waddicor- Science of the Soul Study Centre PO Box 5331 Wellesly St,Ak NZ or:
Go to 78-80 Olsen Ave Mt Roskill, Auckland Wednesday 7.30 pm satsang/Saturday sewa 10 -2 pm or satsang Sundays 10 -11 .00 am-It is open to every one.
Baba Ji enjoys everyone who positively criticises,questions this universal path.
No one forces you to love,accept,reject,worship-this path is 100% about what the individual wants.
Like any support group-we are here on this earth to help each other,to help our selves.
Let it not be said that the "team" blames the coach for not playing well all of the time.We are all too easily swayed by our lack of discrimination in everyday life, why then are we quick to condemn others-when the real problem lies within us all.
In the matter of sprituality-why disparage the Master? When we don't progress within etc
isn't it our lask of discipline,our laziness
that contributes to our lack of satisfaction?
All those who have been to study anything new-doesnt study require honest research and effort.? Therefore to criticise the teacher of spirituality -without finishing the course,which we of our own volition enrolled for-how gutless is that?
No if we are in the onerous position of being a teacher of meditation having achieved-the teacher status though dint of effort and hard work WE would be in a position to judge him now wouldnt we?
Until we are not, all speculation is meaningless. We would be wise to listen to the teacher and study hard the lessons he gives us-each day.
Again Baba Ji loves us enquiring into the path, before we finally accept the teachings.
And if we enrolled already-we better work hard and graduate-as I believe this path once on, there is NO dropping out.
If we do not graduate this semester, then a new year awaits us students of spiritualty.
Now what kind of odds are they?
To all the critics, bring it on-the teacher awaits our appearance on a daily basis at Surat Shabd School.Radha Soami -Inner Church
students-Lord of the Soul.Unwritten law Unspoken Language.

[richard]

To the girl who is looking for a satsang address in New Zealand.
Write to the rep.Tony Waddicor- Science of the Soul Study Centre PO Box 5331 Wellesly St,Ak NZ or:
Go to 78-80 Olsen Ave Mt Roskill, Auckland Wednesday 7.30 pm satsang/Saturday sewa 10 -2 pm or satsang Sundays 10 -11 .00 am-It is open to every one.
Baba Ji enjoys everyone who positively criticises,questions this universal path.
No one forces you to love,accept,reject,worship-this path is 100% about what the individual wants.
Like any support group-we are here on this earth to help each other,to help our selves.
Let it not be said that the "team" blames the coach for not playing well all of the time.We are all too easily swayed by our lack of discrimination in everyday life, why then are we quick to condemn others-when the real problem lies within us all.
In the matter of sprituality-why disparage the Master? When we don't progress within etc
isn't it our lask of discipline,our laziness
that contributes to our lack of satisfaction?
All those who have been to study anything new-doesnt study require honest research and effort.? Therefore to criticise the teacher of spirituality -without finishing the course,which we of our own volition enrolled for-how gutless is that?
No if we are in the onerous position of being a teacher of meditation having achieved-the teacher status though dint of effort and hard work WE would be in a position to judge him now wouldnt we?
Until we are not, all speculation is meaningless. We would be wise to listen to the teacher and study hard the lessons he gives us-each day.
Again Baba Ji loves us enquiring into the path, before we finally accept the teachings.
And if we enrolled already-we better work hard and graduate-as I believe this path once on, there is NO dropping out.
If we do not graduate this semester, then a new year awaits us students of spiritualty.
Now what kind of odds are they?
To all the critics, bring it on-the teacher awaits our appearance on a daily basis at Surat Shabd School.Radha Soami -Inner Church
students-Lord of the Soul.Unwritten law Unspoken Language.

[tao]

To Richard, who wrote (in quotation marks):

"Baba Ji enjoys everyone who positively criticises,questions this universal path."

That's a load of bull.

"this path is 100% about what the individual wants."

That's even more a load of bull.

"We are all too easily swayed by our lack of discrimination in everyday life,"

Speak only for yourself.

"why then are we quick to condemn others-when the real problem lies within us all."

Because the problem lies with those (the false Sant-mat guru/master) who are being condemned for pretending to be what they are not.

"why disparage the Master? When we don't progress within etc"

Because the so-called "Master" is not truly a master, nor is he living what he teaches.

"isn't it our lask of discipline,our laziness that contributes to our lack of satisfaction?"

Who has lack of satisfaction? And who is "lazy"? Speak only for yourself.

"doesnt study require honest research and effort.? Therefore to criticise the teacher of spirituality -without finishing the course, which we of our own volition enrolled for-how gutless is that?"

Most pariticpants in this forum who are initiates, are all quite familiar with and have studied and researched and extensive experience in the path. But no one has "enrolled" in anything. And in fact, you are clearly the gut-less one due to your inability to engage critical thinking.

"if we are in the onerous position of being a teacher of meditation having achieved-the teacher status though dint of effort and hard work WE would be in a position to judge him now wouldnt we?"

Yes that is correct, and that is why some of us here are indeed in that very position of being a spiritual teacher and having "achieved" a significant level and experience of enlightened wisdom, knowledge and realization, and thus are able to judge "him" (whoever "him" is).

"Until we are not, all speculation is meaningless."

I think you meant to say "until we are"... but nevertheless your comment is the "speculation", and it is "meaningless".

"We would be wise to listen to the teacher and study hard the lessons he gives us-each day."

And just who is that so-called "teacher" of yours? But as far as listening to your so-called "teacher" and his "lesssons", for myself I most definitly have no such need to do so. So again, you would be wise to speak only for yourself.

"Baba Ji loves us enquiring into the path, before we finally accept the teachings."

I couldn't care less what your so-called "Babaji" says, or whether or not to "accept" anything.

"if we enrolled already-we better work hard and graduate-as I believe this path once on, there is NO dropping out."

Now that'a load of rubbish. There is no such "enrolled"...nor is there
"NO dropping out". Your mind has been locked into into a rigid belief system and cult mentality which is disempowering and enslaving you, and obstructing your spiritual growth and liberation.

"To all the critics, bring it on-the teacher awaits"

I already 'brought it on'... Its now all up to you to free yourself from the mind and from your delusion and the RS cult mentality.

"Radha Soami -Inner Church students-Lord of the Soul."

That would only be YOUR "Lord of the Soul".... NOT mine.

"Unspoken Language."

Well thats about the size of it. Everything that you have said, speaks virtually nothing at all.

[Marcel Cairo]

I love it. The whole RSSB topic is so foreign to me, but reading all the heated responses is quite entertaining. It's like watching a Korean TV soap opera or something similar in a language you hardly understand. And who could not love Tao's daily thrashing of anything and everything he finds detestible (I know this from personal experience, too).

Thank God, the mystics or Richard dawkins for this online version of access cable TV. It's priceless.

[tao]

Marcel,

Marcel my good buddy... Thanks a lot for the compliment (really). I can always use a little appreciation for my tireless efforts at bringing the best spiritual and existential entertainment to the Churchless Channel Network.

[Pinko]

Just be aware to believe what you see or experience as you say. Even that should be taken with some .....

[pritha]

dear friends,plz.have babaji inside u....you will get all informtions there...:)

[oat]

Pritha,

I would never have that damn "babaji inside" me, even if Brian and Marcel gave me all their zillions.

I don't do "babajis".... and especially not your "babaji", who stinks worse than all the rest of those bogus religious charlatans in the mystic BS marketplace.

So you can tell your con-artist "babaji" (and yourself) to find some other place to peddle his pretentious baloney.

And btw, I am not in need of any so-called "informations"... I've got more than I'll ever use right here in my swami-shaman's neural net, and at my fingertips via the weird world web.

[Aman Dhillon]

Thanks Tao and Richard,my mum-in-law is back in Newzealand last week,she was asking for the address again.Thanks a lot guys

[NJK]

good to hear so many different views and responses over the same thing.
I am a surgeon in the making, and from my proffessonal experiences i can draw an analogy, no matter how many books about a particular surgery you sit and read unless you go out and actually perfoem the procedure yourself you will never know what it is like to experience it. i think that man might be making a lot of sense but unless one goes and actually shut his logical being out for a while and agree to do blindly what he says and find the truth out for yourself, one will never be able to say with affirmation whether what he is talking is making any sense or is it a farse.
its much like love i think which doesnt know any logical boundaries, its only an experience beyond explanation.
faith and doubt cannot co exist guys.
and above all personal experience is everything these r the things that no body can make you believe unless heavens r on your side, unless you have reached that level, into that orbit of your exsitnce in this universe where u r meant to know that ultimate truth.

[the gnostic]

pistis sophia ,apocryphon of john,gospel of thomas ..etc etc the bruce code ,the whole discoveries of gnostic scriptures since 1720 and i mean every gnostic teachings of christ with a little bit of kabbala and buddha and ..etc etc this was the foudation of the radha soami fake science just thiefs who do not have anything to offer to humanity ..i am an ex satsangis ..i am ashamed of myself that once i was a creazy one to beleif the gurus ..folks go and look please to the gnostic scriptures and than you will undrestand from where sant mat has been originated ,,may all beings be happy .

[Poonam]

Dear Babaji,

I am 37 years old lady. I am married and blessed with 6 years old child. I am working in a Pharma company. With the blessings of God, I have everything which a person demand from his/her life. I have good husband and daugther and no complaints from my life but I always feel unsatisfactory, i feel that something is missing and I should achieve that and only achieving the same, i would be happy and get satisfied.

I have full faith on you and seek for your advise and help only in adverse situations.

I have once applied for nammdan when I was unmarried but not succeeded. Since my marriage, I have not attend the satsangs regularly.

I wish to take nammdan from you. I know that I will not be the right candidate for same but I need your shelter. I have nobody so closed to me as you are. Pl. showers your blessings on me and give me the invaluable nammdan.

With love and affections:
Yours and only yours
Poonam

[tao]

Poonam,

Are you kidding? Who are you addressing as "Babaji"? No one here gives "namdhan". Do you think this is a Radha Soami site?

Seriously dear sister, you seem sincere, but you are barking up the wrong tree. And not only that, but you are also wasting your time seeking and appealing for "namdhan" from bogus Santmat and Radha Soami masters. Free yourself from this myth, this delusion. Before you go running off after Radha Soami, and if you want to know some truth and other opinions about Radha Soami, then you might ask Brian who is the host of this Blog. He and other commenters may have a few thoughts to share with you about Sant Mat and RS.

RadhaSoami

Could someone please let me know about Babaji's satsangs at the US?

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[Karan]

Dear Brian,

I am a follower of RSSB and have partially read your book - Life is Fair. I think it is a great book.

One of my friends at Satsang just mentioned about your website and all of us got curious that why would a satsangi after 35 years go astray and that is when I decided to validate your comments.

I have read your website and thought deeply about your comments from an unbiased point of view.

Following is my conclusion -

1. You say that you still practice meditation and would like to achieve the state of nothingness. RSSB faith preaches the same but you don't seem to like the concept of a Guru and the dogmas. If you carefully read RSSB teachings, it really asks you to do nothing in meditation. Even the dhyan (contemplation) that they talk about is not really required. All it says is to concentrate at the eye centre and repeat the names and once your concentration is good enough, you can get dhyan (contempation) of the master.

For a moment, let us assume that the present master is not true. Does it matter in any way if the master is true or not during your meditation since all you are doing is trying to go within by concentration. Repeating the names is a way to concentrate. Even if you say 1-2-3-4-5 it is a way of concentrating and trying to keep focus. Considering, even if everything is fake, it is still helping to go in. I don't really know how you are planning to achieve the zen state without going in. Doing nothing needs lots and lots of practice. Eventually we are back to the 2.5 hours of meditation or even more.

2. I think generating love for something is a key to go in. Without devotion for the lord/truth you just cant go in. I think you might agree that God is Love according to Christianity. Even if we are able to kindle that love by loving a stone intensely (idol worship), I think it is a great step forward to seeing the truth. I think lord would see our desperation to go in and it doesn't matter what you love externally, as long as it gives that intensity and the desperation to go in. I am sure the truth would pull and take us to that direction.

3. I agree to an extent about how people behave in RSSB. However, there is nothing wrong with the path. I read your post on wanting to pee. I don't think the path stops anyone from getting up in satsang. It is just a mark of respect not to get up and disturb others around but I guess you have taken things too literally. If you listen to present Master's satsangs there is only one thing that one is supposed to do and that is to meditate and go in. I think you are doing the same thing...so I don't understand what is the problem really?

4. You say that you used to meditate regularly for 2.5 hours. I seriously tend to disagree that you used to sit for 2.5 hours in one sitting for 30 years and you did not go in. It is just impossible. Good luck with Buddhism or anything else that you are trying to follow. If a person sits 2.5 hours (in one sitting not splitting it up) and does focussed meditation...be it RSSB or any other path for that matter for 30 years he has to go in and he will go in.

Either you are lying or there was a serious flaw in the way you meditated. That's all I can say.

Thanks,
Karan

[Robert Paul Howard]

Poor Karan: this person really is a stranger to both Brian and the history of this site.

Robert Paul Howard

[tucson]

Karan,

I agree with Robert Paul Howard's comment above. You simply are not aware of how extensively all this has been gone over on this blog, for years, upside down and backwards. However, you can't be expected to know that or to go through all the volumes of archives on the subject. Newbies are welcome.

You said: "I seriously tend to disagree that you used to sit for 2.5 hours in one sitting for 30 years and you did not go in. It is just impossible."

--Why is it impossible? On what basis could you possibly make such an absurd statement? What law, and upon whose authority, says you must go "in"?

I personally know of a long time satsangi, follows the vows, never misses meditation, initiated for some 37 years, who admits to never going inside. No lights, no sounds, no radiant form.

[tAo]

Karan writes:

"all of us got curious that why would a satsangi after 35 years go astray"

-- Astray? What makes you assume such a thing? Why do you think that dropping RS is somehow "going astray"?

"I have read your website and thought deeply about your comments from an unbiased point of view."

-- Having read YOUR comments, you do not appear to be "unbiased" at all. You appear to be very indoctrinated and full of presumpyious and unexamined dogma.

"You say that you still practice meditation and would like to achieve the state of nothingness."

-- I am not so sure that "nothingness" is what Brian wishes to achieve.

"RSSB faith preaches ... it really asks you to do nothing in meditation. Even the dhyan (contemplation) that they talk about is not really required. All it says is to concentrate at the eye centre and repeat the names and once your concentration is good enough...."

-- That is contradictory. Concentrating and repeating a mantra (names) is not "to do nothing". You obviously do not understand what you are saying.

"Repeating the names is a way to concentrate. ... even if everything is fake, it is still helping to go in."

-- Go "in" for what? And how could pursuing a "fake", a lie, be helpful? Don't be ridiculous. What you are saying is absurd. Believing and acting upon illuions does not achieve truth. Yours is the same fautly reason and foolishness promoted by other blindy dogmatic satsangis.

"I don't really know how you are planning to achieve the zen state without going in."

-- Fyi, "the zen state" has nothing whatsoever to do with "going in". This is just more ill-informed nonsense.

"Doing nothing needs lots and lots of practice."

-- You can't be serious. Don't be so damn absurd. This kind of statement is far more faulty than it may sound on the surface.

"Without devotion for the lord/truth you just cant go in."

-- That's another false presumption. As if devotion is somehow the price of admission. You satsangis are really an unenlightened lot. And what's worse, you actually believe that!

"Even if we are able to kindle that love by loving a stone intensely (idol worship), I think it is a great step forward to seeing the truth."

-- You are really very very lost... in ignorance.

"I think lord would see our desperation to go in and it doesn't matter what you love"

-- That is childish fantasy.

"I am sure the truth would pull and take us to that direction."

-- That's what all the fools say.

"there is nothing wrong with the path."

-- Really? And how do you know that?

"I guess you have taken things too literally. If you listen to present Master's satsangs there is only one thing that one is supposed to do and that is to meditate and go in."

-- "Supposed to do"? By whose authority?

"so I don't understand what is the problem really?"

-- Then you had better stick around and find out, or read the archives if you have lots of time on your hands.

"I seriously tend to disagree that you used to sit for 2.5 hours in one sitting for 30 years and you did not go in. It is just impossible."

-- You do not know that. You have no knowledge or ability to say that. You are full of presumption and foolishness.

"If a person sits 2.5 hours ... and does focussed meditation...be it RSSB or any other path for that matter for 30 years he has to go in and he will go in."

-- There is no "in"... and you have no certainty to say that.

"Either you are lying or there was a serious flaw in the way you meditated."

-- YOU are the liar. There is no flaw, other than perhaps the flaw in sant mat.

But let me ask YOU a question. What has YOUR meditation produced, accomplished?.. What results have you achieved? And how long have you meditated?

[XYZ]

Hello! everyone thats simply gr8 to see that what really people think about RSSB. But I believe one should not comment so negatively until n unless one has experienced the situation & things & until one has faced the Master. I would like to ask you question : At you school timings have you ever got good marks, poor marks? And who use to teach in the school? If there is no teacher for any of you subject, then?

To whomever posted a reply to Anonymous:

First off, I can not believe you have such lack of respect , as to write "that fradulent guru" . If you can address dear babaji in such a way, than perhaps you are the last person that should be on this site, let alone responding to other's inquiries.

Also-why is it bad for me to ask where he is visiting? I live in Toronto, and our sangat has not had darshan for over six years. ofcourse we are yearning to see him.

Thank you for telling me about where I can find pictures. I am simply asking because where I live currently, I am not in access to a near by satsang-where I can purchase a radhasoami satsang text.

Finally-in response to your ever so rude response about my questoin about sach khand. What part is confusing to you? I simply asked if anyone has been allowed in the property itself in the last tens of years? I know at an earlier time, that property in the dera was open to public, Maharaji Charan Singh Ji gave darshan there at times. I was asking if that was open again. I do not understand why you are confused, nor laughing. I also think you must be ignorant enough to think I was referring to the "sach khand state of mind". That is purely idiotic and i defintley laugh out loud at your lack of a clue.
For your information, I am a satsangi, my entire family is.

For future notice- I think this site is about learning and discussing this glorious faith. I don't think the readers on this site need your negative attitude.

[Anonymous]

Hello again,

I also wanted to make a simple request. This faith can be very easy to follow, common sense to some-such as myself-since I was born into it. But to those who it is new to, it is quite confusing, if they are not given all the information. THat is why, when there are people posting on this site, asking questions, please try and be courteous.
Example-the blogger "poonam" asking about getting namdhan on this site.

It might be outrageous to those that know it is not right to ask for that, nor on a website of all things. But for others it might be a reasonsable question, as they do not have all the information. So please do not give sarcastic rude comments.

We might be in shock at a diciple attempting to give babaji a hug or touch him. But non followers might not understand why we are so surprised.

It is great to have others asking about this faith and wanting to know more about it, I would love for this to be more commonly known and less misconceptions out there. try to make this a positive environment where others can ask questions without feeling your wrath.

[Richard Fu'e Fu'e]

Hi Tao Brian and all the RSSB bashers, keep on belittling,tearing down disparaging-RSSB grows and grows,all ove the world-go to the site www,rssb.org see the millions coming to the path, have a look at the Charitable Hospitables in Beas,Sikanderpur,and Bhota.Go to Petaluma Fayetteville in the US-travel all over the world
and attend satsang in any country virtually.Baba Ji doesnt knock Tao,Baba Ji doesnt criticise Brian-or any satsangi seeker etcin an email blog site etc-why would he? He has over 2 million disciples that are struggling on the path,Huzur had about 1 million 450,000
or so Sardar Bahadur 50,000 Great Master 125,000 approx.
Now they never hurt anyone nor would they-they are lovers-what do lovers do -operatively they LOVE.
Indeed the essence of following a path is to find LOVE.

Even Kirpal Singh after publicly apologising in two Indian Newspapers regarding the defamation of Huzurs Character-came to ask Huzur for his forgiveness-in Beas not long before he died.

As stated in Quest for Light or Divine Light by Charan Singh-when asked about Kirpal Singh -Huzur answered that ...gist "We
have no grouse with Ruhami Satsang, we are very busy here ...etc

But lookat the defamatory comments issued from the anti RSSB
bloggers galorez plathorez,ex satsangi haters of the Surat Shabd
Culti dogmA-anti shabd etc....it is laughable-but I dont condemn you all -I am with you i love you.
An ex psychiatric patient who had been misdiagnosed by western doctors given shock treatment-guess what Im cool now
30 years no drugs,illicit-35 years no booze 35 years no meat eggs fish -sure I am still on pscychiatric meds for "bi polar -but
why am I so happy-that Charan Singh man-whom I wrote to as a child in 1970,saw in 1976-prayed to in the wards after the treatments-and then he initiated me in 82-had an interview 1984 and extreme darshan 1984.Not a day goes by that he is never away from my thoughts-all my songs are about him.my plays my tv characters my film scripts-to all who hate him-its ok
at least you are thinking of him-as Christ says-where there two of you gathered in my name, there I am also.
I have met so mnay addicts,alcoholics pschizophrenics,psychiatrists counsellors etc throuought the world in Beas-one thibg we all need is Love-the one with the most GIVES IT -that person is Baba Ji-why wouldnt he its his job.
On a practical scale of 1 to 10 1 being a ordinary human being
and 10 being one who has become a TRUE human-baba Ji is that
one Charan Singh was a 10.

They say to the knockers -dont believe me -go in and experience it for yourself-you become 10.

beyond intellect Tao Brian-become a small child -jump into
your mothers lap and become 10 -one with God or God himself.

To aall the mentally ill-come to me my burden is lighter but go to Him His burden is the lightest-as He has become the light.

Trust me as a bipolar realist-nothing can stop your soul merging
with the divine-no ex satsangis no anti Charan bloggers no anti Soami Ji.

So i am a 10 I know Im god I have seen God and suffered with human electricty-but Huzrs darshan cured me of 240 volts he has taken me Home while alive beyond all human parameters
I have met all the previous saints present and the future ones
sant mat will never become a religion-it will grow as gZod intended and heal the suffering humanity.Read Philosophy of The Masters Vol 1-5 by Sawan Singh-and see what I have said.

America-God haas given you a mission-go forth and become 10
rid yourself of anti -saint behaviour free your minds from untold
lifetimes of psychiatric abuse-become Baba Ji-the present master-he don't charge a fee.He and I and you potentially are one.So be ready for the love Tao Brian-how do you know you are not 10-by the way prepare your way ,fill out organ donation forms-funeral directors wills -as our time is fast running out.
be such a waste to let our amazing bodies go to waste huh?

Allah O Akbar=God is Great
All Tao needs is LOVE
All Brian needs is Radiant Form

Surat Shabd Yoga cures the suicide bombers of our hateful .
minds
Dont forget your bhajan position-remember 1971 Brian-I think
you were at dera-relax now-see theres Huzur arent you lucky.

[Richard Fu'e Fu'e]

As my former comments have stated ,we are all potential god men and god women-Huzur once said- the soul has no sex.
I know I am part of the infinite and I know who my father & mother are = Huzur Maharaj Charan Singh-I have 6 billion brothers and sisters in the world.
All humans have the shabd ringing within them as do the rest of creation-however in human form-this the form we step off the treadmill of reincarnation-try it sometime Tao Brian-just go in go up -zoom-just like Lao Tze
Interestingly over 500 -1000 Communist Chinese been initiated now.....they are following Lao Tze -the Tao eh Tao and being initiated by Baba Ji-Gee!!!!
Amazing how a non racist & non sexist Master can do so much good.
Anyway like I was saying-i know how Tao & Brian etc are feeling -no progress, all the Ex Satsangis pulling out -"too hard -sant mat bad"
like something from South Park...
how long you been initiated
20 minutes-
you heard seen anything ?
Yep see a big galaxy and millions of suns moons and I hear Steve Miller Band -Fly like an Eagle,,,what about you?
Nah 40 years and I in darkness no sound neither.
What were you in a former life.?
A murdering Slave Owner-
There you go -
Anyway gotto go the big bell is chiming and I want to go see Baba Ji inside-

So I try to love including detractors of Baba Ji but I get bogged down by my racism,sexism my hatred and the higher up I go in consciousness the more love I have for all.

looking at Baba Jis daily programme-techncally as a living saint he takes away the burden of his disciples - and places them on himself.
As he has become GOD.believe it-when a saint makes you ONE with God Tao,brian ex satsangi ,haters of Charan etc-you feel sorry for peopla knocking such a one as Charan Sngh.Grandson of Sawan Singh-student of Sardar Bahardur.
Look at the work from 1939 to 2008 that has taken place in US
the four masters of Sant Mat tirelessly guiding souls such as Brian Hines Tao Ex Satsangis etc -and taking their KARMAS on their backs. You try it!
Now please have some guts and close this defamation -look at the facts -celebrate the goodness of meditation.
celebrate the life of Gt Master,Sardur Bahadur Charan Singh Baba Ji-they got nothing but love for you-nothing but Aroha aloha alofa.Lets us pray.

My Lord, I am ignorant, give me the strength and wisdom to be happy about what you deem fit to give me and about how and where you keep me.I have ,no virtue, no devotion my actions are all dark and sinful and the mind has thoroughly crushed me.
For a sinner like myself, O Lord ,there is no refuge but Thy Blessed Feet Make me thy slave that thouest may become thine and thou may become mine.
I want nothing more Sawan Singh 1957-

America holds the key to East meets West spiritual unity-once Brian and Tao go in-every soul counts.
Go ahead follow The Way

The Lord is all forgiveness-said Huzur-and we are very poor beggars-we should go to him without hesitation-sit in meditation.-and beg-we are ALL beggars on this path.
he knows how hard this path is-imagine billions of past lives trillions of karmas WE have to pay off-of course it is not easy or is it?

Trust me brothers & sisters we are better off staying IN the programme-I look forward to merging into the eyes of a living Christ,Buddha,Guru Nanak,Guru Arjan Dev,Sawan Singh ,Sardar Bahardar,Charan Singh ,Mira Bai,Sahjo Bai, Mohammed,Sultan Bahu,Rumi.Kabir.Paltu Ravi Das-tonight tomorrow -on a train a bus -sitting in meditation at dera Petaluma Haynes Park,Olsen Ave,Amber Rd etc

Ill pray for you Tao Brian-

Our Father
Who art in heaven
Hallowed Be Thy name
Thy kingdom come
Thy will -be done
On earth as it is in heaven
Give us this day our daily bread
And forgive us our trespasses
As we forgive
Those who trespass against us
For thine is the kingdom
Forever and ever
Amen

Hear the sound of love
Within this mortal coil
Our tomb of soul divine
See the inner light clouded by aeons of passions
Walk the path to the wise one
who time has subjected
to the penultimate of love
this wise one holds the key to our salvation
hear his words
practice with utmost devotion
and experience first hand the inner bliss
lord of the soul
master of reality
teacher of the divine
how we love thee so
alofa
alofa
all is alofa.
radha soami ji

[Amaranth]

Richard said:"beyond intellect Tao Brian-become a small child -jump into
your mothers lap and become 10 -one with God or God himself."

I think you took the idea of becoming like a small child way too literally.
There is a nice thing about growing up ( and yes, some people never do ) called reflection - of yourself and of what surrounds you. Ethics comes from this.You can be free of mental problems without becoming naive like a child. Perhaps you should read some Lao Zi again, before you make your wild claims of babaji being the same as him. Nope, not all mystical and philosophical paths are the same.
I think you are projecting your own problems on those who do not follow the RSSB path. You know, there are a lot of people with different religious and philosophical positions who are not confused ( also who says confusion is always a bad thing?! ) and live a happy life. I haven't seen Brian attacking anybody - he isn't against Charan Singh and the RSSB masters. What he is questioning is the institution and the religious dogma of RSSB. Nobody is against loving your fellow beings. Love is not something that is exclusively in the domain of RSSB.

[Catherine]

Just a comment:

I find that the RS supporters posting here are stringing together well known sant mat phrases, concepts and prayers but they are so disjointed that it is as if the capacity for clear thought and reason around the topic is very weak. It is as if freedom is in the process of being taken over and the inevitable outcome will be zombies swinging on a long piece of well chewed gum.

[Catherine]

Wow, just read the Satsangi comments again. I take back my words. I agree, We all need love.

[Roger]

I have a historical question,
based on the following statment,

"Even Kirpal Singh after publicly apologising in two Indian Newspapers regarding the defamation of Huzurs Character-came to ask Huzur for his forgiveness-in Beas not long before he died."

---What did Kirpal do that needed forgiveness? I'm just curious, just a little RS history lesson.
Thanks,
Roger

[Brian]

Richard, you've helped confirm my belief in churchlessness. It's nice that you've found a faith that appeals to you so much, and has given you so much support.

But I'm sure you realize that fervent Christians sound just the same way about how Jesus has turned their lives around.

So what really produces change? Is it something outside of us, or something inside?

You believe that the guru is necessary to find truth. Christians believe that Jesus is necessary. Could it be that the truth is simply out there, available to everybody equally?

Wouldn't that be the most humble, and loving, way to look on the world?

[tAo]

Richard is a sad case. Richard's disjointed knee-jerk rants reveal that he desperately needs to feel more loved, and to have his RS beliefs validated, and to project his beliefs and illusions upon others.

Richard, it's abundantly clear that you are bereft of any rational understanding of where others (like Brian, Tucson, and myself) are at spiritually.

I am also sorry to hear that you had (and still have) psychiatric problems which require medication. However, I am glad to hear that you have overcome your previous alcohol and drug problems. But to conflate it as being due to some RS guru being responsible for that, is simply a stretch of your wishful imagination and desire for a savior.

I did not ever have any such problems or difficulties with santmat meditation as you have suggested, and I also definitely don't need your prayers. I am not in any way like you seem to think that I am. I effortlessly dropped Santmat/RS almost 20 years ago for reasons that you are apparently unable to comprehend at this point in your development. And there are many articles and discussions and comments related to those matters on this site, but you seem to be oblivious to most, if not all of it. You are as Brian said, almost identical to a religious fundamentalist Christian or Muslim. Your religion and dogma is Radha Soami, and you both preach it and impose it upon others who do not believe in it as you do. That is not a loving attitude, and RS is not everyone else's reality.

So it's high time for you to stop assuming that everyone else should or must believe and meditate as you do. Why don't you just be content with your chosen path and leave others alone to go their own way?

I also think that all of your RS ranting and preching is really due to your own insecurities about RS because underneath it all, RS is not really giving you the results that you so emphatically pretend it does. Otherwise, you would not be so desperate in your need and attempts to validate it.

I suggest that you need to do some serious and sincere self-reflection Richard.... and don't worry about the RS exers and critics.

[subhash saini]

when will baba ji came in nz on satsang tour.is there any person (satsangi)in blenheim .

[Juan]

Dear Subash Saini

Babaji is present everywhere, he was in Dalhousie (India)meditating & taking the karmas of his disciples on his shoulders, even his wife was in seva, and now he is in Delhi continuing his meditation.

True disciples should go within to find him and remain in his HUKUM.

[ankur]

radhasomi'
am a student
can i apply for namdan
its almost 1year i used to go to satsang
plz help

[tucson]

Ankur,

This is not a Radha Soami information and support site. Go to RSSB.org for information. You are not likely to find a great deal of support for your beliefs at this site which is primarily designed to question organized religious movements such as Radha Soami and to discuss alternatives to them.

[leannji]

hi..i was wondering if anyone could tell sant mat belief concerning organ donation.
good idea? or too much karma involved?
thank you

[Brian Hines]

I seem to recall that Charan Singh said donating organs is fine. It benefits other people, and the dead person doesn't need them (obviously).

[Catherine]

Organ donation films before satsang??! Is this at the Dera? A short film about organ donation only? Are viewers told who they are registering with and how the whole thing will be handled? Your last paragraph is telling. What interests me about organ donation is that someone will get money for the process, why not the disraught family?

[shamli]

babaji will do every thing all the thing is about faith.it is all his responsibility.

[tAo]

i think its sad when i come across this type of comment from people like shamli who foolshly forgo reason, and choose blind faith instead. they want to avoid taking responsibility for themselves.

[Marika Love]

I was Initiated in 1968, and had a "spiritual emergence-y" in 1971, in the middle of meditating. Since then, I have not been able to focus much on meditation and have needed a lot of healing instead. I find the vows don't seem to fit what works for me, but that ultimately they do make sense. And I can't seem to give up completely - I just have some sort of inner knowing that He is for real. It would be nice to chat online with someone who also has experienced this Path.

[tucson]

Marika Love,

I have experienced this path you speak of as has the blog host and others who hang around here. I once thought this path was the real deal and then I began to see outside its confines.

The vows are conceptual nets that keep your mind within a defined framework. There may be a time in a life when such a structure may appear necessary as a support, but imo freedom, realization, enlightenment or whatever you want to call the recognition of the infinite "Self" requires no such behavioral structure and imo perception of reality, life as it is, is impeded by belief system structures and thinking.

What you are, this infinite moment, is endlessly unfolding as your universe, your life, all that you know and experience. All that is needed is to let your small self-ego subside and reside in/as this infinite moment, the "Big Self". Where else could infinity be but here? What else could it be but this?

A great truth (for me) is that this moment always takes care of itself. You don't have to worry about a thing...vows, rennet, spontaneous sex, coerced meditation need not be concerns because you see that life unfolds quite automatically. The illusion of "self" control is just that, an illusion. Does infinity have to worry about infinity? It IS infinity. How could you go outside it in order to be in a better infinity? Absurd, don't you think? This infiniy right now is pretty infinite don't you think? Sach Khand is no where else but here right now because there is no place but here right now. This moment always is.

Consider: If you did find yourself in Sach Khand, or heaven or nirvana wouldn't it be here right now? This is it! That simple. The eyeglasses you are trying to find are sitting on your nose! You are the Satguru, welcome home.

[Roger]

What is a spiritual emergence-y? This is a new and interesting term. I don't need to know anything personal. Roger

[ashu]

Radh soami ji,
Santmat say that full belive on the satguru but in the problem i feel satguru also cannot listen to us and he say us that these are our before karms but who cut a chain of before karms of jeevatama. In the problem god also not listen to us.In the books of santmat i read that we will prey to for dyha myhar, and one side santmat say that guru know every thing he know all without any speaking so why we will pray for his dyha myhar and any thing he give us only when his willing and also say that all give us our karms. so dyha myhar of guru is also depends on our karms so why we pray for dyha myhar of guru and whole things . It is easy to say and very typical to accept the god willing whose compel to us for accept his willing. At present i fear from my satguru for pray because in my life at this time i feel thattime i pray to satguru i tolerate to opposite of my pray so i feel very fear for pray . Always i pray to satguru and i tolerate to opposition of my willing,god always suddenly face me these thing which is very terrible and horrable and opposite to my pray .At present this situation i feel that a long distance between me and god .By birth i belive in santmat and always think a person do right and god give him also right but now i think that no good and bad matter in my life and no matter of pray to satguru for any thing it is depends only on our before karms and at present only we tolrate the fruit of before karms which is we don't know. i ask that we don't know before karms and next birth we also dont know the before karms these chains of karmas are also a typical circule for jeev atama from akkalpurkh

[Ruhari Abdullah Sawan Singh]

Brian Tao and David Lane ex satsangis who have no spiritual progress.ie they are NOT the Master yet.I laugh at you and await your death of your ego.Had mine in 1984 ego died that day yep just me and master Charan Singh
13/3/1984.Charan became me and I became Charan. So spoilt US satsang boys time for you to die ,to LIVE. Yes My Master is me and I am Master and he speaking to you ex drug dealers and users..time to get on UP to sach Khand. (ps Indians refer to Baba Jamal Hall the satsanghar as sach khand) NO EXCUSES BRIAN ssimran bhajan ..in you go there you are eye centre,now simran...merge with Huzur..now bhajan...thee you go NO MIND,NO INTELLECT NO KKK NO guns...) otherwise back as poor mexicans or dogs or cats....NO BHAKTI NO SALVATION

[Ruhari Abdullah Sawan Singh]

All intellectuals on this path who are initiated prepare to be reborn into next incarnation as maybe human form or animals.OR do your meditation NOW. cheers Ruhari Abdullah Sawan Singh..NO more compromising on he diet Brian,Tao and definitely NO POT!....ps Brian you are wanted at dera to give satsang on Dias w Baba Ji October 2015 thankyou.Tao you too more bhajan...stick to the teachings you ant t be born again? Or do you wanna end this karmic dross NOW? In this lie.So too US sangat.pull finger out and sit in bhajan, two thumbs.You need reinitiation OK.Lets GO!!!!!

[Ruhari Abdullah Sawan Singh]

Right Jesus has been reincarnated as Sawan Singh and He has been reincarnated as Me.USA sangat intellectuals shut the fuck up and get down to basics.You do your simran bhajan.And work together at sewa.Whites Indians blacks et al ok Off you go
You must become what you love you say you love christ? Charan ? prove it.Brian Hines write more books,give satsang go to beas Off you go.24/7 meditation you havent long off you go, Tao Lane Howard hurry up too! There is no time for quibbling America.Simran bhajan love affection shabd exercises ok .Good .We have much building to do.Gopd work USA Radha Soami

[Ruhari Abdullah Sawan Singh]

13/3/1984 Huzur Charan Singh made me himself I died that day. 2004 Baba Ji asked me directly in the Shamiana at dera October session to write a book about Polynesian Spiritualty. Which Inhave been doing the last 11 years.Huzur is with me in His radiant form 24 hours of the day so Im saying Brian get thee to Beas ASAP and start writing MORE books.OK? Stick to the inner progress and do it!!!!! Tao Lane Howard stop fucking about in PIND and GO to SACH KHAND ok via Baba ji and OBEY him/ OK radha Soami Gentlemen.please come to dera.ASAP love Charan Sawan Jesus Ruhari Abdullah Sawan Singh

[Passing through...]

Ruhari Abdullah Sawan Singh:

I couldn't resist responding to your crazy sounding posts to Brian, Tao, and David Lane.

You sound like a nut job. Sorry, but true. Your rambling incoherency does not lend itself to credible evidence that you have died to your own "ego."

In truth and fact, it exemplifies and exudes the false superiority of your belief system. In short, it has provided me with "demonstrable evidence" that you know not of what you preach.

David Lane & Brian Hines: I applaud & respect your journey & conclusions.

[bunka]

Ruhari is trolling big time ..you are not even aware that Lane never stopped meditating and that he loves this path more than you..
Because of guys like you Charan is put to shame
you are trashing Charan with comments like this. I bet you cannot sit still even for 15 minutes.

[777]

Hi Bunka ; Hi Ruhari

Charan's main attitude was " Exemple is much better than prescriptions"

Abdullah might have forgotten Simran
if he is a RSSB initiate

It is Simran which prevents excesses
and it MUST be applied on a 24/7 basis

Real direct physical Darshan does that too but can alas not be practised on a 24/7 basis :-)

Love to you Abdullah Sawan and sweet anahabad shabd to both of you

777