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March 16, 2012

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i did not see that you made a new entry before I made a reply on the previous entry.

you will find my reply to another attempt at a rebuttal there, and it answers your points as well.

I did notice that on about half of the points you said you agree that dems believe what I said they believe. we just disagree on wether or not they are misinformed beliefs. on several others you claimed ignorance and I will accept that from you.

it seems that my hope for meaningful discourse here was misplaced. anyone that believes a coyote is more valuable than a human fetus is truly lost.
anyone who alignes themselves with someone who calls for a "more civil discourse" and them proceedes to praise the notion that anyone who disagrees with them about abortion laws is commiting the public rape of women is beyond reason. You would have to be blind to not see that millions tune in to hear filth from maher yet there is no out cry because the left loves it.

While the republican party commits its fair share of iniquities, it is clearly the closest to the high ground. while there are things (and people)in it I won't defend, there is much more that I will never appologize for. Indeed there is much to be proud of.

you do not disagree with the points I made, you embrace them. I will leave you to your made up science, hatefull museings,and misguided cense of justice. but I will also pray for you and this country. I will choose to do this because just as you have a choice to spew hate towards those who disagree with you I have free will and with that will I choose compasion and understanding.

bob, I responded to each of your claims with a reasoned, mostly factual response. I couldn't respond factually when you only offered a personal opinion, as you did several times.

Almost certainly you don't have free will, even though you think you do. So you necessarily believe what you do, which includes your almost certainly mistaken belief in God.

If certain beliefs give you pleasure, that's one reason you hold onto them. Just don't mistake belief for truth. Reality is much bigger than we are. Reality is what we should worship, not our fantasies.

Thanks for sharing your ideas. I appreciate and value that. You just shouldn't expect that I, or anyone, will automatically accept what you say, just because you say it. Without evidence, beliefs shouldn't be accepted.

"7) In England and Wales, where gun ownership is severely limited, 8% of homicides are committed with firearms. In the United States, with a very high rate of gun ownership, 65% of homicides are committed with firearms. So, yes, guns kill people"

--If 8% of homicides are committed with firearms, then 92% are committed with something else... knives, bricks, bombs, poison, shovels, pictures of Nancy Pelosi, you get my drift.

That's right. Bricks kill people. In countries where there is a shortage of bricks such as the New Guinea highlands I imagine homicide by brick is pretty rare.

I think I prefer to live where I am more likely to be killed by a gun than a shovel or brick (probably quicker in most cases). I'll take the 65%. God blessed America with guns, that's for sure.

And never bring a brick to a gunfight.

What do liberals believe? A liberal named Brian Hines believed a 2008 vote for Obama would fix a list of five things that Obama’s had no positive impact on whatsoever.

Here are your words, Brian, (http://hinessight.blogs.com/hinessight/2008/06/barack-up-lars.html) from 6/22/2008:

“…Nobody is perfect. No presidential candidate is perfect.
But if you're happy with where the country is now...

--$4 gas, with no coherent energy policy in sight
--4000 deaths in Iraq, with no coherent end of war strategy in sight
--huge deficits to pass on to our children and grandchildren, with no coherent budget balancing policy in sight
--Al Qaida and the Taliban still flourishing in Pakistan and Afghanistan, with no coherent terrorism fighting strategy in sight
--habeas corpus and other constitutional guarantees being thrown out the window, with no return to democratic principles in sight

Then, by all means, vote for McCain. He's promising more of the same. Me, I expect more of our country. That's why I support Obama -- because I love the United States, and I'm tired of slipping into second-rate status. “
****************************************************************************************

So, Brian, where do we stand after 3+ years of Obama? By your definition we're still second-rate:

- Gas is back up to $4 a gallon.
- We’re out of Iraq on the Bush timeline.
- Avg. annual Bush era deficit = $250 billion. Avg. annual Obama deficit over three years = $1.3 trillion. http://www.davemanuel.com/history-of-deficits-and-surpluses-in-the-united-states.php
- Al Qaida and the Taliban still flourishing in Pakistan and Afghanistan, with their watches set to the announced Obama withdrawal timeline.
- And I don’t have to tell you about Obama’s record on habeous corpus. All that ‘close Gitmo’ campaign rhetoric had you pretty lathered up I’ll bet.

How’s all that Hope and Change workin’ out for you, Brian?

DJ, good job at researching that comment of mine. I'd forgotten about it.

Yes, Afghanistan and Pakistan are still screwed up. Deficits are still a big problem. Obama hasn't been terrific on the habeas corpus front, or on killing Americans without a court order front. I'm disappointed in these things.

But on the whole, Hope and Change are working a heck of a lot better with Obama than they would have gone if McCain had been elected.

-- This country has the imperfect, yet hugely better than nothing, Affordable Care Act. Millions of people already have gotten health insurance they didn't have before. Other benefits are rolling out steadily.

-- Automobile efficiency standards have been markedly raised. The stimulus program has encouraged renewable energy, along with saving the US auto industry, and avoiding a collapse of our economy.

-- Gays are equal citizens in the military. Big plus.

-- Financial institutions have more oversight, though they're trying to weasel out of necessary regulations.

-- Osama Bin Laden is dead. We're out of Iraq. Libya is freed from Gadaffi. Troops are set to be withdrawn from Afghanistan.

All in all, my wife and I are happy with Obama. Want to bet if he'll be re-elected? I predict a majority of American voters are going to choose him over the Republican candidate, likely Romney, come November.

Fair enough, Brian. You're a good sport and none of us has a crystal ball.

But I am curious about something. With $4 gasoline and a Democrat in the White House it's a rare thing indeed to find a liberal who believes the POTUS can influence gasoline prices in any meaningful way. Yet, based on your 2008 comments you clearly do.

So the question is, what did you believe Obama would do as President to keep gasoline prices under control? Maybe more importantly, what was he saying in 2008 that made you even think he wanted to?

DJ, you're right: the president can't influence gas prices. Here's the evidence.
http://nyti.ms/wbEVxI

What the president can do is make our country less affected by rising gas prices. Obama has raised fuel efficiency standards, which is equivalent to lowering gas prices (more mpg you get, the lower the cost of filling up).

Domestic oil production is up during the Obama administration. Percentage of our use that comes from foreign sources has down. Obama has encouraged electric vehicle use, which are very low cost to drive per mile.

So I'm happy with Obama on the energy front. Wish he was addressing global warming more directly, though.

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Strange Up Salem

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